johnsubaru Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 Hi Guys I have been reading a few posts about Duratec installations and well pretty much any engine really. What seemed to come to light is that a few people feel quite strongly about the Webcon packages. What are the downside of the Alpha Engine Management/Throttle Bodies installation and what are the better alternatives. Cheers John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 As I understand it, the main drawback is that only Webcon Alpha dealers can connect up to the ecu's to view status/settings and carry out adjustments. This may not seem such a big deal, but does make life potentially much trickier, making even simple diagnostics outside the owners reach. (Checking throttle pot settings for example). However, with an investment in some rolling road fine tuning for your specific install, then providing you keep the engine/induction/exhaust/fueling systems exactly "as is", you could argue that you shouldn't need to modify the maping etc. I guess in the end, like most things WF related it comes down to how you plan on using the car, and what you plan on doing with it. Popular lternatives in no particular order include: DTA MBE Omex Megasquirt Emerald Plenty of disscussion in the archives about the relative merits of the different systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnsubaru Posted February 26, 2006 Author Share Posted February 26, 2006 Thanks Gadgetman Too be honest if i had the software to use i don't think i would know what i was looking at anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikpro Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 Thanks Gadgetman Too be honest if i had the software to use i don't think i would know what i was looking at anyway. I am in the same position but want to learn how to do it badly! I have taught myself everything and to me this is the fun. The Westie is not just a car to me but a hobby as it is, I'm sure, for most of us. Learning new skills is the fun and I wouldn't like any avenue closed off. Maybe the mapping will be to complex for my pea sized brain but I at least want the chance to try and b******* the whole thing up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 On a far more basic level though, not being able to access the maps as far as I know, means not beaing able to put a copy of said map on to a CD for safe keeping, so if anything untoward happens and you lose the map, you'll need a couiple of days on the rollers to remap the car. Us non Weber Alpha users just load up from our back up... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perksy Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 Don't fit weber alpha Been there and got the T shirt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnsubaru Posted February 26, 2006 Author Share Posted February 26, 2006 Thanks for the replys guys. Blatman - Surely i could request a backup of the map after a rolling road set up. Is this not possible? or would the tuner deem it a loss of potential revenue in the future? Perksy - Would you care to elaborate? Thanks John PS What about Webcon's throttle bodies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perksy Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 Perksy - Would you care to elaborate? There's very few Rolling road's that have access to the software for checking/altering the map in the ecu. If you live on the doorstop of a weber alpha dealer your ok. Me, i had a 220 mile round trip, to get mine mapped. Even then i needed a new ecu because there's a batch of type PI 150 ecu's that can't be re-mapped With most of the other systems on the market you can connect up your laptop and check various sensor functions, fault find, make some changes to the maps and save a copy for future use etc. With the weber alpha you don't get that.... If i was doing a new build i wouldn't fit weber alpha. Just my opinion though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnsubaru Posted February 26, 2006 Author Share Posted February 26, 2006 Thanks Perksy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete g Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 weber alpha gear is very well made ,never used to be user mappable but at least it means it should be mapped correctly by a dealer. but if you do a lot of up grades it could cost you in long run ,regarding remaps. i think there latest ecu may be user friendly but not sure. unfortunely there customer service is not as good as it used to be. I run weber alpha throttle bodies but with mbe ecu. i like weber kit because its well built.but would only use there ecu again if the ecu program was user changable and price was right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 Blatman - Surely i could request a backup of the map after a rolling road set up. Is this not possible? or would the tuner deem it a loss of potential revenue in the future? I guess so, but as you say, it may not be something the dealer wants to part with. And I suspect a map re-load may not be a free service from a Weber Alpha dealer and as Perksy has pointed out, unless they're within pushing distance it may well involve expense and time getting the car to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conibear Posted February 26, 2006 Share Posted February 26, 2006 I have a Webcon Duratec ECU, thankfully I live near their HO. One problem I have with them is, if I want a remap I have to go to their HO, as any of the local dealers do not have at the mo any facilities to remap their closed Duratec ECU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnsubaru Posted February 27, 2006 Author Share Posted February 27, 2006 Thanks Guys John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corsechris Posted February 27, 2006 Share Posted February 27, 2006 Personally wouldn't care for a totally 'closed' system. Not that I re-map the car every weekend you understand..but if I want to swap, say injectors or fuel pressure, it takes seconds to get the Emerald to recalulate it's maps. I can t1t about with map settings etc to my hearts content, and then go back to square one any time I like for zero cost. I'm sure the same is true of many other systems as well....but not the Alpha. YMMV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morbius Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 Emerald is good. Can't speak for the other remappable ones, but they all seem to get good press. I can take my laptop to a tuners if they do not have the software, but the nearest tuners to me has the software for most remappable ECUs. If you want to go completely DIY, there is a lot of support for Megasquirt, or at least there was six months or so ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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