CleaR Motorsport. A new beginning in Cheshire. Your chassis tunning specialist.

[harrypotter]

6 hours ago, LoneWolf said:

The spring platforms are quite wound up, which paired with the taller top hats, are making the dampers hit full extension IMHO.

A longer damper should be on the cards here to solve the problem, from what I can see. Or a shorter spring.

Might be worth trying the old short top hats as well? As those might give you some more travel in this specific case.

A shorter spring won’t help. The spring needs to be wound up with the platform to gain the correct ride height. 

[Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO]

18 minutes ago, harrypotter said:

A shorter spring won’t help. The spring needs to be wound up with the platform to gain the correct ride height. 

Yep, a shorter spring will lower the ride height. Longer spring or taller top eye would be my thoughts.

[Andrzej]

As for keeping the shock thread in good condition -is greasig it a good idea ? 

 

on the picures one can see how much dirt is kept by sticking to grease after just one ride. 

I was told once years ago (approx 10 y ago) to keep those threads dry. And I can turn rings by hand till now on that car ( or with little help of special spanner for coilovers ) . That car has Bilstein shocks, track only but driven some times on salt track and rain. But to be honest, those rings was time to time moved over the years for changing springs and setings change.

Wonder what to do with Westfields shocks  threads  ?  So far I kept those dry too . Had no issuses with changing preload / height (Nitrons and protech) . But mine Westfields dont drive in rain , opposite to @Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO ' s car which is I think most widely seen od this forum in rain  On the other hand it is aluminum (I assume?) - so - what are other experiences - dry or grease? (shock threads to be clear )  

 

[Maurici- CleaR Motorsport]

8 hours ago, Andrzej said:

As for keeping the shock thread in good condition -is greasig it a good idea ? 

Grease allways.

Any crud and dirt that the grease can attract can be cleaned with a brush and brake cleaner.

Galvanic corrosion cant be cleaned.

[CosKev]

10 hours ago, Andrzej said:

On the other hand it is aluminum (I assume?) - so - what are other experiences - dry or grease? (shock threads to be clear )  

Ians Spax are a steel body with a aluminium spring seat,Protechs are aluminium body and spring seats. 

Steel and aluminium react to each other and cause a really nasty reaction which is way worse than rust etc on threads.

Get some coilover covers,you won't get any debris on your grease on the threads then!

They work really well,easy to remove too being fitted with velcro. 

[DamperMan]

The sounds are very much like the dampers coming to the end of there stroke….  To control the suspension bringing it to a controlled stop in 10mm vs 50mm requires a lot more damping, which would be detriment to the ride quality previously enjoyed.    Also if the damper is topping out the wheel will be unloading from the road, not following the road’s profile..   The dampers supplied are standard length for the rear.    I have come across  cars needing shorter dampers on the rear but non longer needing longer.   I try not to stay awake at night thinking about these things.    These are kit cars and sometimes they are as special and unique as we are. 
 

There are other things which sometimes make noises too which get blamed on the dampers or happen change when ride hight changes…. Handbrake cables now taping something, drive shafts not being fairly horizontal and bouncing between the joints as the wheels go up and down.   These are just a few fairly random things I’ve some across on various cars.   Even an intermittent rattle which turned out to be a fuel float… 

 

As said we can extend the damper tops to increase the open length of the damper if required.      
 

as regards to coating the threads..   There is always a compromise of grease/copperslip/waxoil attracting dirt or keeping them dry. People have very absolute views on what to do.   But if it’s a dry use car it largely does not matter.  Ians car is used in al weathers.     I prefer the grease the threads with copperslip. Once the hight has been set cleaning the exposed thread just to make it look clean.    If the body’s are aluminium or steel and plating it’s important not to damage the coating on the damper as it leads to damper damage.. grit will.. so will turning the collars if loaded dry damage the coating.    On the Spax dampers the thread is stainless steel.   But the anodized spring seats are aluminium so there is potential for corrosion between the two if not protected.   The spring seat is sacrificial not the damper.   The seats can be cut and split, the stainless cleaned up as it’s not at all compromised and new seats fitted.    

 

 

 

[Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO]

Further to discussion with Tony ( @DamperMan) and @Maurici- CleaR Motorsport I wound the perches down two full turns on both sides and stiffened the shocks up to 9 clicks. I drove it 30 or so miles to the Cheshire meet on Thu night like this. The banging was reduced in frequency and intensity over some of our poor quality roads but the ride stiffness was harder and I'd not want to run like this normally. It would be fine on track.

 

I dropped the shocks to 0 clicks on the carpark at the Golden Pheasant and demonstrated the knocking to @Greenstreak-Andy D who agreed it was likely the dampers in full extension. I wound the clicks up to 5 for the journey hold and it was crash and bang city all the way.

 

Yesterday morning, I've reset my front to 140mm and rear to 165mm (chassis rail not lowered floor) with my weight in the car and set the rear shocks to 6 clicks up (front are at 5 clicks up). This is how I've ran since originally fitting the Spax in Nov 2022. A short 15 mile test drive confirmed all the be wonderful and no more knocking. clearly I've undone all @Maurici- CleaR Motorsport good work with the corner weighting, however it was always an experiment for me with my mobile laboratory. I enjoy it. Some experiments work, some don't.

 

I'm just home from a great 100 mile trip round the peaks with approx 50 of those with a 12 stone passenger and the car has ran fine. no knocks, no bottoming out handled great.

 

@Maurici- CleaR Motorsport has kindly offered to take a look at my corner weights free of charge, so I will revisit in the next few weeks, but I'll not be adjusting the ride height at the rear much higher!

 

 

[Flying Carrot Steve]

On 30/03/2025 at 18:49, harrypotter said:

 

Excuse my ignorance but what is the W fig related to and why is 50% desirable.

 

I was going to ask the same. Looks like you've got 53% weight RHS and 47% LHS, but I'm baffled by the 49.9 bit.

 

I'm still reading and the answer is bound to be already mentioned 😂

 

Is the total weight of 721kgs with you included @Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO? Pretty sure it is. 

 

[Flying Carrot Steve]

On 01/03/2025 at 19:35, Paul Baker - Bristol Bath and Cotswold AO said:

Good read on the geo set up session @Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO - I had a similar day last year with our local guy and it was a real education for me, really enjoyed it.

 

Was curious to see the weight of your car though. Mine weighed in a few kilos lighter and I’ve got windscreen, full cage, heater, carpets etc so I was surprised at the weight of Bagpuss. Is the Honda a heavier set up or something compared to mine (Zetec)? That said, the Honda has more power and it’s a long time since I was a svelte 70kgs!

 

 

I'm assuming you had Dave Gallop do your set up @Paul Baker - Bristol Bath and Cotswold AO? How was it afterwards?  I should go see him myself and get the Carrot done really. It's not been done since Northampton Motorsport did it in I think 2019. 

[Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO]

12 minutes ago, Flying Carrot Steve said:

 

I was going to ask the same. Looks like you've got 53% weight RHS and 47% LHS, but I'm baffled by the 49.9 bit.

 

I'm still reading and the answer is bound to be already mentioned 😂

 

Is the total weight of 721kgs with you included @Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO? Pretty sure it is. 

 

Yes. Car is 647kg without me.

 

[Flying Carrot Steve]

1 hour ago, Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO said:

Yes. Car is 647kg without me.

 

 

I'm trying to get mine down to about that weight. I weighed it on the local council platform. It only does one axle at time and is really for trucks so I have no idea how accurate it is. It came back as 670kgs. 

 

When I weighed it myself at home with a 200kgs bathroom scale and blocks, it came back at 645kgs. 

 

Given it's a Zetec turbo with full cage I'm assuming 670 is probably more realistic. Once I've made a few changes I'm sure I can get it below 650, (or 625 if it turns out my weighing was the accurate of the two)

 

My last kit was a 462kgs BEC so I do feel the difference. 

[Paul Baker - Bristol Bath and Cotswold AO]

1 hour ago, Flying Carrot Steve said:

 

 

I'm assuming you had Dave Gallop do your set up @Paul Baker - Bristol Bath and Cotswold AO? How was it afterwards?  I should go see him myself and get the Carrot done really. It's not been done since Northampton Motorsport did it in I think 2019. 

Yes mate, Dave did mine. It hadn’t been done at all since the build and I know the front in particular was all over the place, so felt very different afterwards, very pleased. I haven’t spun on track since….😂

[Kit Car Electronics and Essex AO]

14 minutes ago, Flying Carrot Steve said:

 

I'm trying to get mine down to about that weight. I weighed it on the local council platform. It only does one axle at time and is really for trucks so I have no idea how accurate it is. It came back as 670kgs. 

 

When I weighed it myself at home with a 200kgs bathroom scale and blocks, it came back at 645kgs. 

 

Given it's a Zetec turbo with full cage I'm assuming 670 is probably more realistic. Once I've made a few changes I'm sure I can get it below 650, (or 625 if it turns out my weighing was the accurate of the two)

 

My last kit was a 462kgs BEC so I do feel the difference. 

I suspect your 645 is closer to the mark than the council scales - here's a little summary of a spread of Essex cars:

 

[Flying Carrot Steve]

2 hours ago, Kit Car Electronics and Essex AO said:

I suspect your 645 is closer to the mark than the council scales - here's a little summary of a spread of Essex cars:

 

 

Ooh, I hope so! Be nice to be lighter than I thought. 

 

I have a picture of a previous year's Essex car's weights. Is this a regular thing you do then?

 

I always wondered (based on mine being 670kgs) how they all seemed lighter than mine given I have no screen, heater, wipers etc. So maybe you are right and it is lighter than the council scales said. 🤞

[Flying Carrot Steve]

 

This is the one