New MSA ROPS regulations

[stephenh]

Thanks Nick, will do.  I thought that was what you meant but don't have a photo to hand unfortunately.  It won't show you anything more than the roll bars being welded to the chassis at all four points!

I would be very surprised if that cage was unacceptable to the chief scrutineer at one of our rounds of the Speed Series. If it was unacceptable then most of us are "in trouble!".

[Terry Everall]

Stephen

Presumably it is issues such as not being"MSA approved" cages, tube dimensions, rose joints and bolted connections etc.

The whole issue needs clearer definitions to avoid all the confusion. Some scrutineers do not always know anymore than we do and sometimes make up their own "rules" so we need to now what is correct

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

Is this rule change out for consultation like the list 1B tyre thing was? if so, mount a petition to challenge it to change its wording or similar

[Marto303]

Hi John, it's one of the early Westfield cages designed for the single make race series they did in the 90's/00's, it bolts on to the rear roll over bar so is effectively removable, leaving the rear roll bar in place. Trouble is that it's 36mm OD, so won't meet the criteria specified above, unless someone has proof that it was MSA compliant at the time?

 

How did you measure your roll bar and cage Barny ?

 

I've just measured mine and it's defo 38mm tube, so we should be OK

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

How did you measure your roll bar and cage Barny ?

 

I've just measured mine and it's defo 38mm tube, so we should be OK

 

Barny - It should be just the main rear hoop that you need to measure. The front part of the cage is not mandatory

[tkm_dave]

Barny - It should be just the main rear hoop that you need to measure. The front part of the cage is not mandatory

 

Unless you're over 2000cc.

[Terry Everall]

Please explain the over 2000cc Dave

I know you need a full cage for over 2000cc on slicks but for Road going ?

[tkm_dave]

I may have misunderstood, but I took it that the following referred to Westfields... "(b) Production Cars and Touring Cars over 2,000cc – Rollbar/rollcage complying with K3 or K4."

 

Drawing K3 and K4 both show a front and rear roll hoop. But if I have my MSA categories wrong then regardless of what the drawings show it may not be applicable unless running on slicks. I did think it was for cars over 2000cc and on slicks for this year, but I read it that it was for any 2000cc+ production/road going car full stop for next year?

 

EDIT: I did misunderstand the situation, complying with 1.6.1 means a full cage for over 2000cc whereas complying with 1.6.2 means an MSA spec roll hoop.

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

I may have misunderstood, but I took it that the following referred to Westfields... "(b) Production Cars and Touring Cars over 2,000cc – Rollbar/rollcage complying with K3 or K4."

 

Drawing K3 and K4 both show a front and rear roll hoop. But if I have my MSA categories wrong then regardless of what the drawings show it may not be applicable unless running on slicks. I did think it was for cars over 2000cc and on slicks for this year, but I read it that it was for any 2000cc+ production/road going car full stop for next year?

 

So you were wrong  

[tkm_dave]

Right, so a road going Westfield:

 

IS

 

10.1.2. Road-Going Series Production

 

NOT

10.1.3. Road-Going Specialist Production, Modified Series
Production Cars and Modified Specialist Production Cars

 

??

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

Road going specialist production

[tkm_dave]

Ok, I see now. I foolishly assumed K.1.6.2 would be a step on/increase in protection from 1.6.1 (which implies a full cage for anything over 2000cc).

 

Ta for making me read more closely in to it all

 

This is assuming a road going specialist production car can be classed as a "sports racing car" though.

 

I feel sorry for the scrutineer who I ask to clarify exactly which boat a road going Westfield with over 2000cc is in.

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

Once your familiar with the Blue Book it all becomes easier to follow, so a scrutineer should have no problem.

[Terry Everall]

 so a scrutineer should have no problem.

 

PMSL

[D7PNY]

Just to add my 2p worth...

 

I have changed the roll bars on both my westfields. First was from RAC bar to Playskool bar - Playskool bar cost £250 and I sold the RAC bar for £150 so net cost £100.  Second was a standard roll hoop with some stays welded on to a playskool bar - Again, playskool bar cost £250 and I sold the other bar for £75 so net cost £175.

 

Presuming there is still a demand for RAC bars for folk not wishing to compete then the net cost will not be horrific.  Granted, if the market is suddenly saturated with RAC bars the price might go down a touch but at worst, maybe the cost of one events entry so not a deal breaker in my opinion.

 

I for one, feel much better with the Playskool bar fitted as it is so much more substantial than the RAC bar.

 

Dave