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I've just popped this on my blog but thought it might be better served here to generate some well mannered lock down debate. Or name calling, any kind of interaction will do nowadays! It will possibly be a bit patronising in places as we already know what Westfields are like, so apologies for that. My thoughts on owning a ‘big power’ Westfield With a few years of a 340bhp Westfield under my belt, I’ve found myself more and more hinting others against such levels of power. I did have the word “advising” rather than hinting in there, but that’s not fair as I don’t think a big power Westfield is a bad thing. Quite the opposite, in fact. It’s just a very different thing to when it was a middling power Westfield. Given that I’m strongly considering a rather dramatic change of direction for my car, I thought it best to write down my thoughts on what it’s meant, even if just for my own benefit. I’ll approach a few of the more popular themes when someone mentions a rather silly bhp for a Westfield “It’s a handful on the road” Well, I suppose if it’s a track only car, which mine has been for a couple of years, that doesn’t really matter. However, when it had an MOT, it was a fantastic road car. I never had to change gear to find a higher speed, just ride the massively flat torque curve. It’s a ridiculously docile car which, aside from a slightly grabby clutch (more OEM feeling ones that handle the power are available), could probably be driven by just about anyone. It’s about the furthest from a handful that you can get. What you can’t do, however, is work it on the road. It is far too quick for us mere mortals to be aware of hazards, correct the car over any bumps, change gear, process what’s going on around you, have to change gear again and even by the time you’ve read this, you’re significantly above any speed limits or indeed speeds where you’d survive and accident. To that end, it does stop being a Westfield, and become the world’s smallest GT car. Great and smoothing out the corners and cruising up to the next one with the gentlest of squeezes of the throttle. Thoroughly dangerous when deploying all of the horses. This is not a bad thing. In some ways it’s positive because you tend to drive slower and smoother, and you already know that you genuinely are the fastest thing on the road and have nothing to prove. The person with a 150bhp Westfield accelerating hard for 15 seconds between corners might be having more fun though. “You can’t keep it cool” More power, more heat. More revs, more heat. Can’t really escape that one. A Westfield also doesn’t have a lot of ways of getting rid of that heat. The bonnet opening is filled by a radiator originally specced to cool a 1.0 Polo. Now we’re trying to use the same area to cool a power output a comedy factor more than said Polo. This is where you spend your money. The radtec radiator/intercooler combo was the single biggest investment in the turbo projects and it’s fulfilled its role beautifully. These are the coolant and intake temps recorded over a track session that must have had 26 minutes of full speed work. That was on one of those rare summer days with actual sun as well, so mid 20s plus the sunshine baking the tarmac. Those peaks are within 1.5 degrees of each other – to handle that for all that length of time is particularly impressive. Though of course, I deserve more praise for staying out there that long. I’d say one of the benefits of having a large amount of power is also that you can afford to lose some. My engine runs a tiny bit rich precisely to provide a little bit of cooling assistance. “Turbo engines are laggy, peaky and difficult to drive” You tend to see these comments from the older generation, and that’s fair enough… they’ve driven 80’s turbos and, frankly, they’ve earned that opinion! None of it holds true nowadays though. The very modern turbo engines are impressively responsive. I think the only criticism you can throw at them nowadays is they don’t tend to rev that high anymore. My car sits in the middle of those two extremes. It’s not laggy, it’s not peaky and it’s easy to drive. It also revs to 7.4k and makes power all the way there. But it’s not as responsive as something like an EcoBoost when lower in the rev range. Fine on track, but I do think it would be a bit frustrating on the road. Then I suppose, we’ve already decided that the throttle is to be used sparingly on the road. Also, is it any worse than an N/A engine with cams aimed for top end power? Back to throttle response on track, it’s fine. You don’t wait for the power to come in. You don’t wait for the boost to build. It’s all there if you ask for it. Take the following graph of throttle position (blue), boost (red) and RPM (beige?): This shows the entry into a chicane, balancing the throttle through it and powering out of it. The throttle has been off for 4 seconds before this, suggesting I’ve caught a car up and it let me past on the exit. You can see the first input into the throttle produces an instant response from the turbo, and this is from 3.3k rpm so reasonably low for track work. This tracks the throttle position until the second application, where by the turbo responds again but is held back once it reaches the actuator level. Here, because the RPMs are in the mid range, the boost level is reduced to manage that massive lump of torque turbos like to give. Perhaps the reason they’re often described as peaky. The boost is now following a rising limit to keep the torque curve as flat as possible. At the gear change, the throttle is off 100% for 0.5 seconds. The boost follows this, taking 0.6s to achieve 21psi again. Which yes, is higher than it was originally set but crucially, not higher than it has been mapped for. Either way, I think that’s plenty responsive enough. So what do I think? Big power doesn’t ruin a Westfield. I’m 100% confident in that. What it does do though, at least for mere mortals, is change it. I’ve found that corners on track are mere obstacles to be cleared ready for the next application of power. Get the car slowed down (no mean feat!), turn in, get it roughly near the apex, balance the throttle, wait for it to straighten out, then deploy the power down the straight ready for the next corner. It’s made me lazy in many respects. On a sequence of close together corners or chicanes, I won’t be taking stabs of throttle between them. Just a gentle squeeze to smoothly get me to the next one without arriving too quickly and giving myself too much to do. Quite the difference to when I had 150-160bhp on throttle bodies. I suppose in that respect it’s ironically safer on track as you don’t tend to go hunting for those extra tenths. You don’t need to. It’s probably quite telling that since fitting a turbo, I’ve never spun on track. I’ve gone straight on at corners more than once! But never spun it. There is only ever one thing quicker than me on a track, and that’s a lighter, less powerful Westfield/Caterham. They’re usually on slicks, so a more serious effort than mine, but typically 100bhp or more down on me. And if they’re quick enough to catch me up despite the deficit on the straights, it shows how much I waste through the corners by not applying the throttle or pushing the car. Which isn’t speed I’m wasting, it’s fun and personal reward. I’ve had a lot of fun with my Westfield, and I don’t regret any of the options and even at my most modest I think I’ve done a really good job of breaking the 300bhp barrier in the right way. Even if I never actually meant to. But I’ve had my fun now, and it’s time for a change. For a long time now I’ve wanted to build another, knowing what I’ve learned over the last 7 years. So I’m going to rebuild this one, with less power, and more revs, and less weight, and more noise. Goodbye gentle beast. Hello bl**** idiot. That’s an RX-8 231 engine. It’s going to rev to 10k+, it’s going to breathe fire, it’s going to drink fuel like it's a water wheel and confine me to the noisy step on track days… and every now and again… it might even work!

A 9 mile drive today on backroads to take me to my walk.

Hi all, I joined a little while ago but have just picked-up my first Westfield. It’s a 1800i Zetec - and it’s a peach! I found the original builder via the forums - just to say hello and to compliment them on the great work! I’ve been grateful for the help and advice that I’ve already had via the forums - so thanks v m. I’m based in Somerset, in sunny Minehead, and looking forward to meeting up with anyone down in this neck of the woods once the madness is over! Look forward to the summer and catching up! Thanks! W

My Spats from my FW we’re showing their age and had a few stone chips and a couple of cracks ,I looked to see if anyone was making carbon ones but no one is ( Mick Cooper is on the case ) .Ive had a few bits hydro dipped ,but as the spats are up front I thought dipping wouldn’t be durable enough so I asked around on Facebook .I got talking to a guy living in Holland called Don Fulford on the Westfield site and he said he’d Carbon skin them for me .I sent them off and 2 weeks ish later they’re back .To say I’m impressed would be an understatement he’s done a great job I can’t wait to get them fitted ,👍

Yes it does, I've got it on my 7 Black. You just add the speed trace, G-Meter etc as overlays on the app. Really easy to use... I wouldn't post many of mine with telemetry though as I'd probably get locked up 😂

So jealous! Exactly what I had planned for last Sunday... Until the cycle wing decided to get more closely acquainted with the tyre 😂

Uhm, yes, about that... On May the 24th it is the official National Drive Your Westfield to Work Day, which is a normally a week where we encourage you to leave the normal daily driver at home and experience driving the Westfield to your place of work, raising smiles on both your face, and those who join you in the daily drudge. But due to a certain pandemic, this may not be possible (my car is still SORNed due to wfh) so I would like everyone to get creative and get a picture of themselves with their Westfield! A selfie, a picture taken by a member of your family... as long as it is a fresh picture, everything is submittable! You have the week from 24th to the 30th to participate 👍 Have a look at previous years: 2019, 2018 and 2017.

Little test of the GoPro telemetry, next thing to do is work out how to export the raw data it so I can use it properly or track days and when setting up the the new engine. If anyone has any advice on this please PM me https://youtu.be/K1PqQtVCBZU

Thanks guys, it is definitely better and the more detail you can add the better. Adding the 'old' build and set up manuals has been really helpful! For a slightly longer term project you could add a section for Old/Obsolescent/Unable to supply items for that we have fitted, but you no longer stock or have a supplier. On a number of occasions, you have been able to direct me to an alternative supplier i.e. ZK In-tank fuel pump. This would help out those of us with older cars to source replacement parts - sort of a Westfield Heritage Page? Oh yes and more Westfield merchandise - Pat, I still want that A5 notebook(Moleskine) with Westy Logo!

Hi Mike I think its because you purchased a separate membership and possible didn't upgrade from trial membership !!, anyhow I've credited another 30 days onto your membership to allow for what was remaining on the trial membership. Thanks Mark

Good catch up with everyone and see everyone in good spirits last night. Thanks @Ian Kinder (Bagpuss) - Joint Peak District AO for setting up. Apologies about my ear @Robin (Red Spider) - Yorkshire AO. 🤣

At least I got to see Luke's ear.

Honestly, we moved forums twice, while he was away, and he still keeps finding us! 😜

Sheesh... life members.... who’d ‘ave “em 😁

🤣 yeah on here it’s harsh - Locost builders will give you hell for it!

very true. It turns out that six out of seven dwarves aren’t happy.

What is making me laugh is the fact that it’s a terrible pun was right there in the subject title, people nonetheless open the topic and then are surprised and annoyed to find a terrible pun. You’ve only yourself to blame. 😄 😛

Worth remembering that DonutMunchers can confiscate your camera and analyse the data should you get a tug with it on display too. In GoPro Quik (PC version) Click on the speedo symbol near the bottom of the screen You can then chose what you wish to overlay: You can drag them about too: This is the last time I drove Bagpuss, two months ago today 😂

I'll hold the door open...

If you think I wasn’t a casualty until lockdown, I’m sure there are quite a few members who can offer evidence proving otherwise. 🤪

The standard ECU presents a lot of problems to overcome to make it work, where as an aftermarket ECU allows you to do what's best for the engine and installation rather than keeping the standard ECU happy. I think it will be worth the cost to get an aftermarket ECU, even if it's a "traditional" one not a plug & play one.

Let's not forget that these are Kitcars, and as such not all of them are bought, many are built. Some people (myself included) enjoy the building as much, if not more than the driving. Being able to modify parts of the build, upgrade parts etc for many is part of the fun of owning such cars. The fact that I opted to build mine with an engine uncatered for by Westfield for me was the challenge and a V8 was always going to produce lots of power and torque but for this build I wanted a V8. I share your view on Turbo cars of this type though, my last build had a highly tuned Cosworth Sierra engine and when it came on boost it got lively. 50-100mph recorded at 3.2seconds!

How many times have we read "there's no such thing as too much power"? - well, I agree with @Dommo - huge power can be extremely entertaining, but it can sometimes change a car to the point where it's less enjoyable as a package. I have a similar story.... I have a bit of a "thing" for the Fiat Coupe, especially in 20 valve turbo form. After my first relatively standard example (tweaked very slightly to 240bhp), my second and then third somehow fell onto the very slippery slope of chasing power. Thankfully, I also had the presence of mind (and hefty credit card limit...) to also put in lots of effort into the chassis, so at least it was capable of handling the power. In the end, I temporarily broke the 500bhp barrier, before winding it back slightly to 488bhp (one more than a Ferrari F40!!). It is ballistically fast - 0-100 in 9 seconds, 0-150 in 19 seconds, or more impressively - 60-120 in 7.5 seconds! and on to something in the region of 190mph (it's geared for 205!) However, the performance is difficult, if not impossible to enjoy anywhere on the public road - by the time I'm getting a buzz, I'm at speeds that would result in a custodial sentence if caught. Basically, I've spoilt the car. It was great fun at 350-ish bhp, but I stupidly carried on. Partly because of the inability to enjoy the full potential of the Fiat and partly because I wanted something I could tinker with (there's nothing left to do on the Fiat), I bought my Zetec-powered Westie. 170bhp is fine most of the time - I very rarely find myself wanting more power and I just make sure I drive on roads where 170bhp is more than adequate (ie the many enjoyable Peak District outings...) One of the endearing factors about Westies (and their owners) is that no two are alike - each car is a reflection of its owner and is all the better for it. After only a couple of years of Westie ownership, I have realised that there is almost certainly a "sweet spot" for power, which results in a great blend of accessible performance and fun, without spending a small fortune to only be quicker along the straights (which as we all know, are only there to join the corners up...) It will be interesting to see what rotary power is like in a Westie - I expect it will suit it well - watching with interest!

see the swear filter doesn't approve of your engine choice

We could see this:

I’ll get me coat...

Blatters is now using nefarious means to boost his count by “BBT-ing” a few thousand of his items for sale 🤣

Are you still here?

Great to see this being actively worked on! Would there be any chance of listing older models in the 'model specific' section too? As a 90's SE owner it would be great if I could click it to easily see what is still available that will fit. Appreciate this might mean more (and perhaps less well sold nowadays) parts being added to the catalogue to work well, but I'd definitely benefit from knowing what was and wasn't viable when planning jobs on the car.

After talking to B19 I think that they are trying to work out how they can comply with the Motorsport UK guidelines. Paddock space will obviously be an issue as will the start line ( marshals cant touch the cars) for cars with no reverse or handbrake. I would also not be happy that marshals cant touch your car or you when you have an incident on track!! Visions of injured drivers or car in the crash barrier or upside down would not be good. They are also working out who needs PPE etc I am not going !

Yes that’s the nub of it. Plenty of us use bike ITBs (I run GSXR 1000 K1/2’s on mine) - but I’d be fairly certain that not one single person would use an OEM ECU with them. The only time we’re likely to use the OEM ECU is with OEM injection. Good luck with the project 👍

Me too 👍🏼👍🏼😀😀

That's good news. How painful and expensive is the process? Perhaps you could write it up on here, to benefit other potential French buyers/members etc.

now with french registration

anyone fancy any of these? https://www.trackday-solutions.co.uk/trackdays its run buy a guy from another club.

Morning all, Noticed a few of you enquiring about the front led indicator spacers on here so these have now been added to the shop. https://parts.westfield-sportscars.co.uk/body-interior-electrical/lighting?product_id=1588 Any other missing items or issues please let us know. Thanks Parts Dept

These guys used to build BMW engine'd 7s (stay with me!)... http://www.thelathropes.com/index.html They also do or did a supercharger kit and recommended a "K-Data" ECU. I've never heard of that, but it might be worth a chat with them to see if that ECU will suit your needs. The standard ECU runs a MAF from memory and there's probably some witchcraft that could make it work, but I can't see it being good witchcraft!

Only 6 weeks away now. Hopefully it will go ahead. Anybody else interested in going?

It does include closing and opening the throttle again rather than foot down and full boost arriving 0.6s later...but you're right, if someone is more used to a "stabby" throttle then that's a sure way to show up more than an enthusiastic but not brutal gear change. I did weigh both engines in the same state of dress (well, very nearly). MX5 engine including alternator, loom, flywheel, clutch, manifolds, turbo, downpipe came in at a surprising 144.2kg. The RX8 engine in similar state but without exhaust manifold was 126.7kg, so all in probably 15kg lighter. They're not spectacularly light, distinctly average on that front. The weight is concentrated lower down and shorter in length than a 4 cylinder engine so I'm sure someone better than me could notice the weight distribution change! I've got the RX-8 engine loom attached and unlike the MX5 loom it's quite a tidy affair. I think I'll probably reuse it which lends nicely to either the RX-8 ECU or a plug-and-play aftermarket effort.

Thanks all! i picked up a beaut of an 1800 SEIW on Tuesday! Had a 70 mile drive home and absolutely loved it. Sound track was as great as the drive! if you make it Porlock then give me a shout! Thx W

Completely agree with @Paul Aspden here - perfect power level for a road car / tourer. You can really give them some stick in this power range which I find a lot more enjoyable, taking them completely through the rev range! Have you had a thought on what engine you might like? x-flows and pintos are quite popular choices from the "Old school" perspective, with Zetec / Duratec / Red Top / Honda etc for something a little newer! Good luck with your search - It might be worth letting people know what your budget is, as cars (tend) to fall into certain price categories generally although of course there are anomalies to this rule! Cheers, Brads

Another lockdown casualty.

I’ll describe a lap of Croft for you right right right right right right left right right left and it’s all flat.

Finally got my Peak district fix today. Driving down Winnats Pass. Also we stopped off at Tagg Lane dairy which was open for take away.

Finally someone that wants a road car with a sensible amount of horsepowers! A few cars available on Facebook sound like they may fit the bill, good luck with the search

We have these 👍

Tango Butt! Does this Photo mean Tango man has secretly got himself a tramp stamp?

There's sumfin wrong wiv da wigglies..... and it's in there..... gizza shove and I'll have a butchers....

Hot Rods! You must go out like that. 😁👍

Just prior to first post-lockdown outing