JimNoble Posted December 20, 2002 Share Posted December 20, 2002 I am more than a bit shocked at how flat that rollbar is - surely the whole point of a rollover bar is that it doesnt squash flat when you turn the car over. ? If asked, Westfield will readily admit that the standard bar is only cosmetic. The "RAC" rollbar is made from CDS (instead of the welded seam construction of the standard one), and has additional bracing (one across, two back (optionally detachable) and an optional petty strut. I wussed out on cutting slots for the rear struts (and didn't know to buy detachable ones), so made this mod instead: 05-04-2002 diary entry 04-05-2002 diary entry Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterrosey Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Personally I think that Westfield are irresponsible selling the 'standard' roll bar and should not offer anything other than the RAC version. I'd even go so far as to say the WSCC should get involved to have the stock version removed from sale - petition the company? Imagine if Ford knowingly sold a car with a roof so flimsy that the occupants would get crushed in a rollover. They'd get sued out of existance - don't want the same thing to happen to our favourite sportscar maker... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Peter R - That is your personal opinion on Westfields roll bar I trust The WSCC wil not and never will be involved in petitioning of products sold or distributed by Westfield or ANY car parts supplier / manufacturer. Similarly would you appreciate someone telling you how to run your business They are the specialists in the field and have successfully made parts for a considerable number of years. One photo is shown of one roll bar - what about the other many thousands sold and used without a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickpargeter Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 That picture is enough to put you off buying a Westie. How safe are these cars? I am (or was) actively looking but have 3 kids to think about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham.J Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Doesn't bother me, just spend a little bit more out and get an RAC jobby, it's only £240, how much do you value your life, how much is a standard bar, subtract that from £240 and there you go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian.m Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Nick, any open top car is going to be less safe than a tin top in a rollover situation, the Westy is no worse or no better, but it has a lower CofG than most all others, and an agility/ability to get out of most trouble. You really have to look at it, as has often been said, as riding a 4 wheeled motorbike. I think the RAC approved bar is a must for anyone searching for or building a car, and you can always wear a lid. But if you have any reservations regarding buying a car you really must try one first, bear in mind in a Westy you are small and low, lower than on a bike and equally difficult to see, if my experience is anything to go by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian.m Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Whoops, didnt mean to post then, must have started on the xmas vino a little early. What I was getting round to saying was that sitting in traffic with an 18 wheeler each side of you, (all the wheels over your head height), is something that has to be experienced). BUT come the open road, well I'll say no more, thats what its all about. Brian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickpargeter Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Anyone got any piccies of a car which has used its RAC rollbar for comparison? This may reinstill my faith. I know were not talking Volvo safety here but that picture is quite frightening and I am surprised that they can be fitted. I would definately go the RAC bar route if I can be sure they are that much safer. Can they be retro-fitted? You've got me thinking now ........how about side impacts in these cars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Nick Brian has it right. Think of safety in a Westfield as active safety. Roll bars and airbags are all very well once you've been hit, but how about getting out the way first? A Westfield is incredibly agile, and very quick. If you have your wits about you, you'll be out the way before trouble strikes (assuming you can deal with fear without becoming too scared to move! ) As a *very* experienced biker (ex Despatch rider, in London. 17 years.........), I'm very used to thiking this way. It's something you need to rehearse mentally, and prepare for, as best you can. It's certainly kept me alive for the past 20 years or so.......... Side impacts would be painful. A side impact from a 4x4 would, in all probability be *very* serious, or even fatal, especially if the bumper missed the roll bar from the side....... And even if we could re-assure you, there is always the un-forseen........... Me, I don't think about the risks too much because if I started to risk asses the things I do, I'd never leave the house, eat a burger, drink beer, race, ride motorbikes, fly, cross the street, etc. And I'd still die........of boredom................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Oh yeah, the rest of the roll bar pics are in this thread............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu999 Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 You've got me thinking now ........how about side impacts in these cars? Noooooooo! Dont think like that! Look at the situation from another angle. YOU ARE AT LESS RISK DRIVING YOUR WESTFIELD THAN YOU ARE CROSSING THE HIGH STREET AS A PEDESTRIAN. RAC bars can be retro fitted (GrahamJ has just 'done' his) or alternatively you can have a full cage made aruond the cockpit area (see Westfieldman 2002 avatar). The hood isnt much use then though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Westfields are no greater risk than any car - If you were able to count the fatal Westfield accidents against those in shall we say a Mini I think you would find that the percentage is a lot lower Life is a risk - Live it, do it and enjoy it - you get one chance - I've lost a very good friend over recent years and the thing that gave him most pleasure (besides his wife and kids) and that was his Westfield - Did he say what if and how and why - No. Never cross roads cos the side impact on a human rib cage is pants and we're not fitted with SIPS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CateringVan Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 I'm glad to hear that a decent rollbar is available and that its not too expensive either. I agree with the 'active safety' comments, but there will always be a time when they dont get you out of trouble and if you then flip the car you will need a decent roll bar. Its a big mistake to think you'll never have an accident because it can happen to anyone - the Cateringvan that I posted the photos of was on an empty wet road, he slid into the bank and was flipped over. Unlike a motorbike you are strapped in so having the whole weight of the car on your head is not avoidable, therefore the bar has to be strong enough, otherwise why fit one at all ? Side and rear impacts are a worry because theres not a huge amount of metal between you and whatever you hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hilux Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Interesting point made in older thread...... Yes, the age of the bar may have played a small part in its failure, but the main reason it failed is that the car was still travelling forwards during the accident and the rollbar had no rearward bracing to stop it folding flat. Westfields bar will probably be ok were they to offer braces. Not up to `RAC` spec of course but its interesting that they dont. Perhaps they should offer only the `RAC` spec bar with detachable struts then its up to the individual Hilux Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham.J Posted December 23, 2002 Share Posted December 23, 2002 Yes you can retro-fit an RAC bar, as stu said, I've just done it, here's some pictures: Old Bar RAC Bar Unbolt the old one and bolt the new one in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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