Discount on hold for club members

[zoso]

Did I miss the point where we were being held at gun point to have the car certified?!

If you don't want to do it, or don't like the idea, then don't do it!

Personally I also think it's a good idea for westfield to keep some info on file about who built which exact car etc etc.  This will surely help future potential owners to have a bit more traceability, and therefore be happier in buying a used westy!

Yet again, the new management take the time to consult with/speak to the club.  Kudos to Julian and all involved, it is appreciated!

[rgs_laverda]

Also the whole factory built thing is complete rubbish, the factory builds them to a cost in a given time frame. Thry can be built better it just takes longer. As I have intimated in earlier posts the factory attaches removable panels with self tapers, there are ways of doing this better. Its just cheaper and faster to do it that way.

That is my complaint about my XI: the factory rushed through the assembly and did a sloppy job. I would like to add some more information but the WSCC Club Secretary says I must wait until Mr. Walker completes an investigation of my complaints. I tried to raise this exact same issue for public debate and comment, but the topic was locked by the WSCC. I hope this topic will remain open long enough for a complete airing of the issue.

  Having a central database of all cars is a great idea, it could be vary useful to a prospective buyer. A Certification program is a good idea too but only for the factory built cars. Otherwise it is the 1st step down the road of "factory approved mods only"  which ends up as "stock only". Just wait until the insurance company refuses to pay off a claim because the car was "non-standard" or "not built to approved specifications".

 Edited for content and clarification.

[zoso]

I would like to add some more information but the WSCC Club Secretary says I must wait until Mr. Walker completes an investigation of my complaints.

To me, it looks like you've just blatently ignored what you've been told by the club secretary there...

[scott beeland]

The point I'm making is just because a car isn't factory build doesn't mean the quality is poor and there are lots of non-factory build cars that would command a good 2nd hand price, -

Charlie. You're absolutely right with what you say. I wasn't implying (or agreeing with suggestions) that factory build cars are better than customer builds. There's some stunning quality out there....Home built and factory built

I was merely suggesting that some of the vitriolic statements made by a few on this thread as regards factory builds was unnecassary; unfounded and VERY sweeping in its assumptions

[Julian Turner - Westfield Sportscars Ltd]

Surely you have all this information already ? - unfortunately we only have the original person who purchased the kit or the car, there is no tracking of upgrades or insurance work etc via an electonic system

You should know what cars are factory built, module kits etc etc.  - As above

Surely if someone gives you a chassis number you can tell them already if it was factory built ? - This is correct but as the vehicle changes the information can also be updated throughout the life of the vehicle

How does the Certifying process fit into all this ?  The certification process will feed information into this database and any changes can be electronically logged.  This can then help with technical support, advise on the state of the vehicle, provide a purchaser comfort that the factory have looked at it.  It can also help with any insurance work that is required.

[scott beeland]

Each to their own........But I'll have mine inspected/certified please Julian

[CarlR]

Zoso,

Unless you source 100% of the parts from westfield (if I understand Julian's plans correctly) then you are un-able to certify your vehicle as westfield approved.

If you can afford the extra premium charged by westfield for their parts which in some cases are identical to other supplier parts, (brake discs, brake lines, calipers, CV joints, diffs , seat belts etc etc) then you can qualify for the expensive plaque.

If you want to own a westfield and want to build it in the traditional method of buying the majority chassis from westfield and then sourcing re-conditioned, new or secondhand parts yourself you cannot qualify for the certification despite producing a vehicle of comparable or identical quality.

This lack of qualification or certification means that a car built in this manner is considered inferior and will command a lower re-sale value.

Some people are simply financially not in a position to buy a turnkey solution from Westfield and would find their car being worth less at time of re-sale simply because the equivalent parts were sourced elsewhere, others just want the enjoyment of traditional kit car building and the fun of sourcing the parts elsewhere.

I can't see any benefit to this, the factory would be best placed to offer a registration scheme to prevent false claims of manufacture and offer a service using the skills of the factory builders to inspect prospective secondhand purchases.

[Julian Turner - Westfield Sportscars Ltd]

Please can i repeat what i said earlier.  You CAN have your car certified by the factory whether it is a kit or not AND it does not matter whether you have used Westfield parts or not.

[scott beeland]

then you can qualify for the expensive plaque.

This lack of qualification or certification means that a car built in this manner is considered inferior and will command a lower re-sale value.

I can't see any benefit to this, the factory would be best placed to offer a registration scheme to prevent false claims of manufacture and offer a service using the skills of the factory builders to inspect prospective secondhand purchases.

And you know how "expensive" this service is going to be already?....Will you pick my numbers for this weekends Lotto please  

Preventing false claims of manufacture is largely what this idea is all about. Is it that hard to see?

[CarlR]

QUOTE

Preventing false claims of manufacture is largely what this idea is all about. Is it that hard to see?

QUOTE

Westfield  provide a safe product for you to drive in a safe environment.  We have designed and thoroughly tested the parts we have made and worked with suppliers to ensure that this is mirrored throughout the supply chain.   That is why we personally test development vehicles prior to them going to production, putting them through hell and earth in order to simulate the worst possible operating conditions.  If this is not done the weakest link fails every time.  Fitting none tested or standard parts can mean this is the weakest link.  I have seen this on some of your vehicles and pointed it my concerns.

Scott, a very large problem seen on numerous cars just suddenly disappeared in a few hours, I think the certification plans started out a lot bigger than they ended up today. Problems like that don't just disappear. By all means get your factory made car inspected and stop going on about it....

[Julian Turner - Westfield Sportscars Ltd]

I have nowhere mentioned the price of this and therefore your claim for it being expensive is invalid

[mhc]

How does the Certifying process fit into all this ?  The certification process will feed information into this database and any changes can be electronically logged.  This can then help with technical support, advise on the state of the vehicle, provide a purchaser comfort that the factory have looked at it.  

Does this mean that cars are to be inspected at the factory, so they can be certifield.

This is surely a good idea.

westfield can then see all the modifications ,upgrades,and fashion changes that the owners have put into their cars.

Select those that will improve the factory cars and incorporate them in their own products.

The finest R&D avalible and it has't cost a penny.

I  like it.

Regards.

P.S Not being critical I love the cars

[CarlR]

QUOTE

And you know how "expensive" this service is going to be already?....Will you pick my numbers for this weekends Lotto please    

QUOTE

I have nowhere mentioned the price of this and therefore your claim for it being expensive is invalid

Oh the delightful irony    

[Martin Keene]

The finest R&D avalible and it has't cost a penny.

I  like it.

Exactly... And just about every main stream car manufactuer has a used approved scheme. Why should Westfield be any different.

[rgs_laverda]

I never thought that a discount was a given right I presumed every penny discount I got was because I had earned it with the work I do with the factory and the relationship I had formed with them.

Barry, it sounds like you are almost an employee: provide a service & get a discount. You have to EARN your discount by working with the factory and forming a relationship with them. That is great for you as a private citizen, but doesn't that put the club administration in an awkward position?

   The discounts are given for services rendered as per your post above: but the WSCC is an independent organisation, should any WSCC staff be recieving a payment of any kind from the factory? Even an indirect payment such as this discount for UK WSCC members? Should the WSCC be providing a service TO the factory to earn a discount for it's members or does that eventually end up compromising the integrity of the organisation?

  How can the public be sure that decisions taken are not affected by the desire to maintain a positive relationship with the factory. But are instead of benefit to the owners and builders first and the factory second. An owners club should be an advocacy group for the owners, not a buffer between the owners and the factory, not an arm of the factory PR department.

 There are many advantages to being as close as possible to the factory and the people who work there, but there can also be problems as well. It is very hard to be critical of those you know well and like personally, even harder to not give your friends "the benefit of the doubt" when issues arise. Who's feelings does one care most about hurting, ones mates down at Westfield, or some stranger who posts on the WSCC Boardroom with an awkward question?