Welly Jen Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 Ironic that Kit cars pre 2000 could be as dirty as you wish but if you want one on a 2015 plate they have to be ultra clean and you have to prove it at IVA And of course, no kit car owner would ever do something on their car just to get it through IVA, or MoT, then change it after... Perish the thought. That said, I find it incredible VW never considered the inevitability that they would be caught. Not very bright at all. Jen 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s2rrr Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 Isn't this similar to F1 cars tyre pressures being 0.3psi under but ok really. I was going to change my Passat but maybe as Scott says a class action could prove beneficial as the car was obviously not as described or suggested in the sales blurb and the emissions may be higher when on the road. I still got 57 and 52mpg on my way back and to work on Friday but who is to say the computer hasn't been rigged as well. The upshot is they may get away with it as the cars passed the tests as required to do so and as specified by the legislators. Now that they have checked the test methods they have unearthed this mess. Very odd that VAG fessed up though. Change the test and use technology to change the engineering to achieve it. This will be an interesting one and I suspect other manufacturers are also doing similar and possibly from the same motherland or was that fatherland, I digress. The legal questions will drag on for years is the problem failing the test as prescribed, which I don't think they did, or failing a better more thorough testing method. Moved goal posts I suggest. If they offered me 25% discount on a 180bhp Passat I would take one tomorrow, not a bad bus. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 Lunch break on a site I was working at this week; one of the sparkies, who I've know for years was ranting about his VW - one of the ones that's just be added to the list of affected models, I let him spout self righteous crap about how deceived and hard done to he was now, how he'd chose the model believing what VW had told him and a whole Olympic length speech that could have come straight from The Guardian. Must have gone on a good five minutes before he stopped to properly draw breath and launch into the rest of his tirade. So while the brew hut was stoney silent, I just casually asked, "Paul, didn't you drive your brand new diesel straight to the chip tuners on the way home from collecting it, to get the engine re-mapped? Didn't you say you'd had the highest performance one that "turned off all the emissions bulls***"?" Needless to say everyone was taking the pee out of him the rest of the afternoon... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew O Byrne White - Ireland AO Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 The upshot is they may get away with it as the cars passed the tests as required to do so and as specified by the legislators. Not quite. VW used a defeat device which is against the requirements of the test. They fessed up because they were caught out by a group of people trying to prove that VW's are as efficient and clean as claimed and found the claims didn't match the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arm Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 How many people will lose their jobs over this, tens of thousands maybe more. Direct manufacturing and sub component supply. Is that what the German, European or US economies want. Maybe it was a big mistake, maybe they should have been clear on how the results were achieved however thats done and its not as bad as the damage lurking ahead if this isnt resolved quickly. Chances of the US legislators seeing that or calming it down . Two tenths of f***k all. The wrong people will lose out on this one and that makes and ass of the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff oakley Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 What will happen is that the tests all around the world will change. On the radio to night it was said that the EU test is in a lab, rolling road I assume and cover less than 11km to obtain a pass. So the test is so badly flawed if that is all they need to do to pass. It went on to say the vast majority of people do not give two hoots about this, as they realise that the claims are always wrong on MPG in the real world. Those in the trade still see this as a short period of pain followed by the realisation that it has not made a difference. The Green lobby smell blood and are stringing it out. The head of VW will probably be thrown to the wolves and as soon as the next "star" has his dangler cut off the media will be bored with VW and that will be that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XTR2Turbo Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 What are the emissions on a car when it is 3 months old or 12 months old and the injectors a bit dirty, engine worn, EGR valve blocked etc anyway? Would they even pass the test ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemsley Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 It's about trust and integrity, and another once trustworthy brand has shown that they pressed the self-destruct button. Several people have commented already that VW could have anticipated this. I could imagine that in some committee meeting several years ago a very senior executive presented a risk assessment, and the management placed their bets? From what I have read this is not accidentally optimistic interpretation of results, it's a carefully designed system? I don't think this is so much about whether it is possible to beat the testing system, that's always going to be open to abuse to inventive engineers. This seems to be about deliberately misleading customers and employees. It is possible other manufacturers have done the same..like the LIBOR rate rigging scandal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kit Car Electronics Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 What are the emissions on a car when it is 3 months old or 12 months old and the injectors a bit dirty, engine worn, EGR valve blocked etc anyway? Would they even pass the test ? The pass threshold on a new car is significantly below the actual limit to ensure they remain compliant at mileage, so yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SootySport Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 This brings into question the VW values on emmisions for petrol driven cars made by VW as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonPeffers Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 On the financial side hedge funds lost billions short selling VW shares in 2008 and I wonder if they got a fair bit back lately with the recent share price drop? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenh Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 I have to say I am most impressed by the fuel consumption of my new Skoda Octavia, according to the on board computer. Miles better than my old Volvo V50, and they're both 2 litre turbo diesels. Must be a very good on board computer!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhett Turner - Black Country AO Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 I have to say I am most impressed by the fuel consumption of my new Skoda Octavia, according to the on board computer. Miles better than my old Volvo V50, and they're both 2 litre turbo diesels. Must be a very good on board computer!!!!! Apparently there is some software that's included with VW group diesels that detects that you are monitoring the consumption and alters the system so that the fuel consumption figures meet your requirements Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Williams (Panda) - Joint Manchester AO Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 just read a german site and 177 dsg engine is on the list.... so I wait with baited breath as thats me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 Does this emissions test actually affect anyone at the moment? It seems mostly the yanks banging on about it. For us will fail an mot? So they lied or cheated and that's crap but in the real world what is the effect actually going to be? Hopefully some cheap tdi vw??? Probably not I've only followed it sort of here and there but it seems that its the initial emissions test of the car or its the Californian tests. Do we even test for NOx here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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