Blatman Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 Bob. Jon's just having some fun at my expense........ As for back to back testing....I did a round at Curborough in 2001 on the 15's, then about 4 weeks later the 13's were on. Not same day, but the conditions were comparable. I went over 1 second faster, on a single lap event. A lap at Curborough is 32 secs for top List 1A runners. My best (on 13's) is low to mid 36's. My best on the 15's was a high 38. My best 4 weeks later on the 13's was a mid to high 37. My aim for this year is to be in the low 35's, approaching the 34's. the car in his avtar is his road car - it has 15"s on, his sprint car has 13's Spot on. My 13" wheels are 6x13 K&N Minator's. I use Falken ZE502's (with a *much* harder compound than I thought. A wear index of 360, not 280, as I mentioned before...) 185-60 at the front, and 205-60 at the rear. My sprint car has around 230-240bhp, and weighs in at around 570kg's I believe Terry Nightingale has had some input in to the developement of Guys car, as he has with some others, including a Speed Series champ, IIRC. So no doubting the pedigree. As for empirical evidence, has *anyone* tested 13's and 15's back to back? I'm sure if Guy had, he'd have mentioned it. Has Terry Nightingale? Perhaps someone should ask him........ Nice havin 2 cars - lucky b*******. Skint b*******......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 My best on the 15's was a high 38. And mine - using 15" rims and a ickle 1600 CVH compared to a 2 litre Cossie lump TAXI - AND HURRY UP - Coat on and runnin He'll say Blatgirl beat me at Wiscombe next But she beats lots of people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Murray Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Anyway just to fire things up a bit and as an aside, I chatted with Terry Nightingale a few weeks ago about 13" v's 15" debate, his recomendation was simple: 1) On BEC's and cars with less than 200bhp, 13" rules! 2) Cars with more than 200bhp, generally do better on 15". (This isn't a verbatim statement of what he said, so please don't start getting all picky about the word "generally" or anything, but we chatted for about ten minutes on the subject and in a nutshell the two points above sum up my understanding of what I was being told). These results were gained from back to back testing by Terry. Now don't shoot the messenger here lads, these are TN's words of wisdom not mine and, in my opinion I think he know's what he's talking about. So in a nutshell TN has done back to back testing and the above is the outcome, as told to me. And I wouldn't fib, because I know for a fact that Terry personally reads these posts on a regular basis Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted March 25, 2003 Share Posted March 25, 2003 Guess I need to read more closely. I'd be interested in the fine detail of the findings, but I guess I've got little chance of finding that out now...........I guess I'll have to let my enormous budget and burgeoning talent speak for me..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windy Posted March 26, 2003 Share Posted March 26, 2003 Windy here!!!!!!! Interesting read. Tyres are not as important as experience. Knowing how to exceed the limit of a tyre and control it there is far more important than one that grips well. Grip only helps to inspire confidence until the limit is reached, beyond which it is a grey area to most people who seem to get frightened when the lmit is exceeded. My advice is to get yourselves on a day with Don Palmer. He teaches the art of driving sideways to get a feel for how tyres perform beyond the limit. Money is better spent here than on tyres - my opinion But then again after a day spent with him your car WILL need tyres anyway. List 1A all much of a muchness in terms of grip but as Guy suggests its the way the carcass behaves that counts. Windy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison Posted March 27, 2003 Share Posted March 27, 2003 Having the wrong diff ratio also makes a difference 240 bhp is all well and good, but speed is related to revs at the end of the day and taking all day to pull high revs = slower Common law of physics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doomZday Posted March 28, 2003 Share Posted March 28, 2003 Any of you guys tried the Kumho ECSTA V70 A tyres? They're road legal (at least in Sweden) and slightly cheaper than Yoko A032 (at least in Sweden). Although not available in all sizes suitable for 13 inch wheels, there is a nice size of 195/55-14 which easily can replace the 185/60-14 found on some Westies. Available sizes can be found here. I've ordered a set for my own car, and I'm running on 14 inch wheels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guy g Posted March 31, 2003 Share Posted March 31, 2003 A lap at Curborough is 32 secs for top List 1A runners No it's not - the fastest one lap time on List 1As is 33.01secs. I should know since I did it in June 2001. The 32.94 quoted in the Curborough year book was done by Rod Ede at a ASWMC event on Hoosiers and without a screen, and as such is not a valid record for class 2B. This should be corrected in this years book. Likewise 2 laps is 59.83secs - July 2002. No-one else in 2B has been under 61secs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted March 31, 2003 Share Posted March 31, 2003 The 32.94 quoted in the Curborough year book was done by Rod Ede at a ASWMC event on Hoosiers and without a screen, and as such is not a valid record for class 2B. This should be corrected in this years book. Oh well, another fact bites the dust. Does anyone tell the truth anymore..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petrol.Head Posted March 31, 2003 Share Posted March 31, 2003 As nobody seems to agree if 13" or 15" tyres are best you could play safe and say :- (13" + 15")/2 =14" Ureka Could this be the Answer Sorry just joking But seriously I may try a lower profile set of tyres on 14" rims as plenty of 1A tyres are also available in the good old 14" rim size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guy g Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 As nobody seems to agree if 13" or 15" tyres are best There are two schools of thought; 1. Those on 13" who insist they are best despite going slowly 2. Those on 15" (and one some specific tyres) who beat all the 13" shod competitors by huge margins. I think the results speak for themselves. Add the advice from Terry about BECs and lower powered cars. And the statement that on List 1Bs 13" are better. You have the complete picture. It's as simple as that!! Take the advice or not - the choice is yours. Plus if I was doing over 35 secs at Curborough in any Westfield I wouldn't be looking at the tyres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Nearly bit through my tongue............... 1. Those on 13" who insist they are best despite going slowly My turn to be irritated....... Never said they were best, just that I found them better for me. Better for me means I feel like I can read the car better. Is that a bad thing for a novice? I am going slowly. Never said otherwise. What I have said is that at every event I have done, I have gone faster. I may well have gone faster anyway, but I am certainly not going slower because I use 13's instead of 15's. The counter point could be that perhaps I'm not progressing as fast as I might because I'm using 13's. At the moment, given the condition of the 13" tyres I was using at the end of last season, I'd find some more improvement using a nice new set of boots of almost any size........... Those on 15" (and one some specific tyres) who beat all the 13" shod competitors by huge margins. I'm not winning, but I don't expect to be. Nor would any novice, unless they had previous experience. I don't have much experience at all. As you say, tyres alone won't make the difference. Again, I never said they would. However, if we assume you didn't set your 2B record on your first trip around Curborough, then I'm guessing you had to work for it. Plenty of practice, lots of timed runs, some test days at Curborough? It came after gaining considerable experience and knowledge? Well guess what, that's what I'm trying to do to. However, experience and wisdom is harder to come by than knowledge. Asking "irritable" questions helps me to gain knowledge. I'm getting the experience, just not quickly enough. But I'll get there.......... Plus if I was doing over 35 secs at Curborough in any Westfield I wouldn't be looking at the tyres. Now who's trying to score points? And for the record, I'm not looking at just tyres this year, other than buying some new ones as mentioned ('cos the ones I was using are absolutely knackered). I have several other mods to do first. You know about one aspect of them already, and I'd like to publicly thank you for your input on that last year. I also discovered something else last month too. Something quite obvious too.... Heres to getting below 35 seconds at Curborough on 13" 1A's.......The Class C boys seem to manage it OK, and there's 2 of them below 35secs on 13's........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guy g Posted April 2, 2003 Share Posted April 2, 2003 My turn to be irritated....... I'll drink to that!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted April 2, 2003 Share Posted April 2, 2003 Must be my shout then........... What'll you have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted April 2, 2003 Share Posted April 2, 2003 That's very good of ya A large brandy pleeeeeeeeeease Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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