Which event in history.

[Mark Stanton]

September 1985 - The Belfry, Sutton Coldfield, Birmingham           (I woz there) and it were bostin      

[Nick M]

1988 Italian Grand Prix.  The atmosphere there must have been electric.

Wonder what was so special about this race ?

- McLaren were walking the championship and had won every race so far that season

- Ferrari were going through a very lean patch

- Enzo Ferrari died a few weeks before the Italian GP

- Ferrari pull of a 1-2, against all the odds, in front of their home crowd at Monza.

[the bear]

Outside the Pomme D' Hor hotel (now liberation square) Jersey Channel Islands on the 9th May 1945.

You only have to stand in the square late at night even now to hear the voices.

[James]

bergen belsen concentration campwhen it was liberated just thinking about it sends shivers up my spine

Its incredable what cruelty one human can inflict on another or an entire race for that matter whats wrong with people? I include terrorists in that statement

[Buzz Billsberry]

1. 1st contact with a species that is not indigenous to Earth.

you mean the Welsh surely?

Buzz

I hope for your sake the Welsh Wizard's memory is shorter than the time between now and when she next sees you.

Andy

Don't worry Andy I will remind him be sure of that!

Buzz

You definitely need to worry now...he is a she...

Andy

Good point Andy!! pooh time!!

[Buzz Billsberry]

During our Le Mans trip the wife and I visited the WW1 Battlefields at the Somme.......................................

Spooky

Amazing

Incomprehensible

Lost for words

I think everyone should try, at some point in their lives, to visit the beaches at Normandy or the Somme, if only to try and gain a sense of scale about the number of people who died in WW1 and WW2.

The military cemetaries are huge (and merely the tip of the iceberg) and so very many of them have no names, simply a cross or Star of David.

Well said Nick... I know its all a bit deep but I’m really into the human psyche. I like to see people under pressure and how they react to 'threat and fear'. Can you imagine what was going thro' the bombardier’s mind on Inola Gay before he released 'Little Boy' on Hiroshima and incinerating it. I wonder how he remembers the 6th August 1945?

Buzz

[taffy]

Quote (Blatman @ Sep. 14 2004,08:27)

1. 1st contact with a species that is not indigenous to Earth.

you mean the Welsh surely?  

Buzz

Hmm, just saw this, bl**** cheek!    

Rob

[James]

He probabley spent the rest of his life trying to forget it!

Orders or no orders you still know you had your finger on the trigger

[James]

Heres one for you:- if you were the bombadier on the inola gay and you knew the destruction it would cause, under the same set of circumsances would you pull the trigger?

[markcoopers]

Hiroshima, when the bomb fell.................that would be a real eye opener to what man can really achieve if determined enough.

Also quite like the idea of being present the day Watson and Crick realised the structure of life it's self

[Buzz Billsberry]

Quote (Blatman @ Sep. 14 2004,08:27)

1. 1st contact with a species that is not indigenous to Earth.

you mean the Welsh surely?  

Buzz

Hmm, just saw this, bl**** cheek!    

Rob

weren't me taffy      

Buzz

[Buzz Billsberry]

Heres one for you:- if you were the bombadier on the inola gay and you knew the destruction it would cause, under the same set of circumsances would you pull the trigger?

Tough one James this is exactly what I mean? could you live with your decision do you drop and 50k+ people or let the war go on and perhaps have even more people killed? which is exactly what happened anyany when they dropped the 2nd one on Nagasaki just 3 days later.

Buzz

[Blatman]

We don't *know* the *full* circumstances though. I'm not meaning to belittle the point, but we don't.

He was apparantly a pretty normal bombardier, so one must assume that any other bombadier in the same position at the same time would do the same thing and drop the bomb. My question is, what about the bombadier who dropped the bomb on Nagasaki? He had to have known better what the likely outcome would be, and he still did it...

Both are braver than me, whatever the situation...

[Buzz Billsberry]

We don't *know* the *full* circumstances though. I'm not meaning to belittle the point, but we don't.

He was apparantly a pretty normal bombardier, so one must assume that any other bombadier in the same position at the same time would do the same thing and drop the bomb. My question is, what about the bombadier who dropped the bomb on Nagasaki? He had to have known better what the likely outcome would be, and he still did it...

Both are braver than me, whatever the situation...

Agreed...I don't think you're belittling the act. The crew had no real idea of the immense power and the implications on what they were about to undertake.

As for the second crew well a question mark could be over there heads plus media reporting in those days was very hit and miss plus the government of the day was the media; you know every thing censored. No doubt the powers that be kept the 2nd crew away from any such attention/distraction and looked after them like hero's.

Buzz

PS these are just my personal beliefs

[Nick M]

You also need to bear in mind the context of their actions.

I certainly have never fought in a war and have no concept of how I would feel about an "enemy", particularly one who was responsible for the deaths of comrades, friends, family, countrymen, etc.  Maybe the bombadiers *wanted* to drop the bombs, and only with the passing of time have the consequences of their actions come to haunt them ?  Or maybe he sleeps soundly at night knowing their actions saved millions of lives ?

War changes a lot of things and can make previously unacceptable things acceptable.  Bombing civilians for example.  I'm not condoning that by the way, just pointing out that it happens.

It seems to be about finding the means to an end and weighing up the consequences of *not* doing something.