Ireland explained.

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

13 hours ago, pistonbroke said:

Wheres Spike Milligan when you need him ?

 

Anyone here ever read Puckoon        

 

Yes, and 'Hitler - My Part in His Downfall'. Terence (Spike) Milligan had a wicked sense of humour that has tickled me ever since I used to listen to the Goons on my crystal wireless. He also recorded the Paul Gallico story 'The Snow Goose' which had me in tears driving home from work in the seventies. Lovely man.

 

 

[jeff oakley]

It is a difficult path we are on and no offence meant to Andrew or belief he is one who is extremist in his views on humour. People who now go on courses or who are at school are taught that much of what was humour can still be funny but can be seen as offensive at the same time.

 

Take this case, 100 people could read it and find it funny, as truly there are some strange things currently happening in Ireland and NI that we find out of our understanding based in history, however if 1 person finds it in anyway offensive or stereotypical, then it is considered wrong. People have the right to be offended and now many organisations are falling over themselves to never cause offence to anyone.

 

Telling someone to get over it, or man up is just not acceptable and unfortunately some out there sat in their room seem to search for something to be offended by so that some of them get more likes than others.

 

An example of this sort of thing I witnessed in Barbados at a plantation house. Here the black female tour guide was actually telling about the number of Irish who were sent out to the plantations and died as a result of disease etc. It was the Portuguese who then saw a business opportunity and started supplying slaves from Africa, who being more used to heat survived much better and some did well as a result.

 

The tour guide went on to say it was an awful period of time but she was thankful as now barbados gave them a great way of life much better than she imagined she would have had in Africa. Que American woman trying to tell her she was wrong and how she should feel about the suffering of her people, the woman was white and probably lived in an affluent area who had no idea of what this woman had but she felt offended enough to make a point about it and basically made herself look stupid. The tour guide stood her ground admirably I thought.

 

We have the capacity for so much greatness and yet the capacity to allow others to reduce normality to be abnormality easily apologising endlessly for.

 

In this case, the Irish have a right to look back on history and the British did some horrible things to them. like we did to many people who disagreed with us, but with much of the rest of the world we have moved on with Ireland that wound is kept open even now by those who want a united Ireland again.

 

I don't know the answer, look back at jokes we heard in the 70's and laughed at but now they do seem less funny, now there are groups dissecting jokes looking for hidden meanings. Black humour has always been a British trait, it was a relief mechanism, but there was no harm intended now who would dare in certain circles to make a joke,

 

Many of our great comedians are fearful of this new wave of "woke" is the current term. stifling them but when I see Ben Elton in October I will not be looking for a meaning I will look for a laugh and many others hopefully will still do that.

[BigSkyBrad]

Almost on a daily basis I'm asked what part of Australia I'm from (and do I know their auntie who moved there in the '70s, like there's only one village there!). A surprising number guess South Africa, and ocassionally people get it right first time and say New Zealand. Confusion isn't helped by the half a million Kiwi's living in Oz (the aussie IQ level sky-rocketed when that happened!) And I show great pride and enthusiasm in putting people right.

 

The fundimental difference is the 2000 miles distance between the two countries. Other differences are they say 'feesh and cheeps' where we say (apparently) 'fush and chups', we are better looking, more intelligent, and ******* way less sheep than they do (though they will tell you we ******* more sheep than them).

 

At the end of the day it's healthy banter, and has gone on for two hundred years, since the convicts (got) moved to Australia and the seal bashers went to NZ. NZ and Australia wouldn't be the best rugby players without that friendly rivalry (now I've upset the English!)

 

 

As an aside, the Kiwi accent is the youngest national accent in the world, and it's creation is pinpointed to a school in the 1860's during the Otago gold-rush. The first wave of children at that new school  probably had an Irish english teacher, a Scottish maths teacher, an English science teacher etc, and on the way to and from school they would have heard American, Chinese, mainland European, etc accents from all the gold panners, shop-owners and traders etc - the Kiwi accent is a melting pot of all that.

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

It's worth mentioning that the Gaelic/Celtic nations did not have the monopoly of being oppressed by the English (it is we of that nationality who seem to always be the guilty party) in history. The English lower classes were also mistreated by the established 'ruling classes' as were the Irish/Scots/Welsh/Cornish et al. Having an identity as clear as being Irish or other smaller nation gives a useful handle to wield when hitting back. The atrocities perpetrated by the imperialists (not only British, other European nations did their share too), were not carried out by the ordinary Joe/Josephine Bloggses, but by these same 'ruling class' members as cleared the Highlands, etc. It was a real class divide much greater than any dreamed up by Momentum and their chums. "Stand up for the Oppressed English" is my motto! 

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

My son used to have a Kiwi girlfriend and it amused me when she said something about a 'chick book' and one of her friends having a lot of six. I tumbled to it eventually but she was history by then.

 

Said Home Counties born son is now living in Sydney married to an Australian girl whose father was Chinese, and whose mother is ethnically Chinese but hailed from Vietnam and whose mother tongue is Cantonese. My God can she whip up a decent meal for a dozen people out of seemingly nothing though! With all that background to consider one has to tread very carefully indeed!

[Andrew O Byrne White - Ireland AO]

Apologies, I shouldn't have opened this can of worms. I realise that it wasn't posted on here as a brexit related thing, but it's almost certainly how it was written. One of the reasons it hits hard is that the situation up there went through a horrible phase, but has been steadily improving for a long time. Hard brexit is the first time in many years it looks like there's potential to go backward. There are a lot of these written lately to make a joke of "the Irish question" when for me, (and most Irish people I've spoken to about it) it absolutely is not a laughing matter as there currently isn't a visible way to resolve it. A hard border is no joke.

 

Certainly for me, this is not a wound held open by any desire for a united Ireland. Whether or not there is ever a United Ireland is a decision for the people of the North, not those of us from the Republic (btw, nobody in the Republic calls it "the South"). It's a wound freshly re-opened by brexit.

 

I'm all for humour, but given all of the history (very crudely summed up here as "a successful 30-year campaign of violence for Irish unity") and the unknowns presented for the next few months, this isn't the right topic for it at this moment.

[jim_l]

 

No apologies required I am sure, you have every right to object if something on here causes you offense. If it happens again raise it again, your post will have raised a 'Think about it' flag with a lot of members, perhaps not everyone. 

 

You can see where I am from , also of Irish descent (as we nearly all claim to be)  Put 'Scouser' into the search engine here, you can amuse yourself for hours. Do I occasionally raise an eyebrow, yes!

 

Jim

[Paul Hurdsfield - Joint Manchester AO]

Well if we're all claiming Irish descent.

my maternal grandparents were Irish, my sister was born on St Patrick's day, we went to St Patrick's school and my eldest son married a Cork girl.......jeez I'm more Irish than half the population of Ireland.......🤔

[BigSkyBrad]

@Man On The Clapham Omnibus Since the advent of EFTPOS, I hardly ever use my chick book nowadays!

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

7 hours ago, BigSkyBrad said:

@Man On The Clapham Omnibus Since the advent of EFTPOS, I hardly ever use my chick book nowadays!

 

😄

[Blatman]

On 29/09/2019 at 14:58, Paul Hurdsfield said:

Well if we're all claiming Irish descent.

my maternal grandparents were Irish, my sister was born on St Patrick's day, we went to St Patrick's school and my eldest son married a Cork girl.......jeez I'm more Irish than half the population of Ireland.......🤔

 

So you really are a Leprechaun?  

[John Dolan - Wirral & North Wales AO]

9 hours ago, Blatman said:

 

So you really are a Leprechaun?  

 

Damn, wish I’d thought of that first.

[SootySport]

On 28/09/2019 at 11:46, jim_l said:

I guess some people are wondering how to react this exchange, I  hope you don't mind me intervening. 

 

I am in process of being educated by my grown up daughter that there has been a significant change in the way the world thinks about references to race, creed, colour, gender, sexuality, etc.   We used to think it was all OK as long as no offence was meant, and I am absolutely certain no offence was meant here. 

Jim

Same here, I’m being re-educated by my daughter as well.

[SootySport]

On 28/09/2019 at 11:46, jim_l said:

I guess some people are wondering how to react this exchange, I  hope you don't mind me intervening. 

 

I am in process of being educated by my grown up daughter that there has been a significant change in the way the world thinks about references to race, creed, colour, gender, sexuality, etc.   We used to think it was all OK as long as no offence was meant, and I am absolutely certain no offence was meant here. 

Jim

Same here, I’m being re-educated by my daughter as well.

[SootySport]

On 28/09/2019 at 11:46, jim_l said:

I guess some people are wondering how to react this exchange, I  hope you don't mind me intervening. 

 

I am in process of being educated by my grown up daughter that there has been a significant change in the way the world thinks about references to race, creed, colour, gender, sexuality, etc.   We used to think it was all OK as long as no offence was meant, and I am absolutely certain no offence was meant here. 

Jim

Same here, I’m being re-educated by my daughter as well.