iain m Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Good timing CTD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted November 13, 2013 Author Share Posted November 13, 2013 the spur thing is the little light that comes on when you pull the cord. I cant remember the wire that I used. but i do remember asking about it on here and researching it and getting the right one. its damn thick and made of several cores. my guess was loose wire too. the basic story: its in the house that i rent out using a well known national agency to manage the property. about 2/3 months ago the tenants put in a complaint that the shower switch had stuck in the on position. the agents told them not to worry as it was "on" and the shower worked. they then started to get this fishy/burny smell. then on monday the hole appeared and the tenants dad said turned the power off at the fuse box and they called the agency, who called me.... i am livid as if this could have turned out a whole lot more serious. I use the agents to make my life easier. i have my suspicion that the switch was incorrectly wired but i cant prove anything. iain yes they can be tricky i agree. i didn't fit this switch it was done by a contractor. the one i fitted stopped clicking properly just after the tenants moved in. i remember the cables being difficult to connect but fortunatly it goes into the loft so its easy to poke them back through the ceiling into the loft though the back of the box ifswim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue ass fly Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Dom I had exactly the same problem with a fused spur that i used to run my koi pond pump and uv light with - prob about 500 watts The spur was in the utility room After a couple of years my missus complained of a fishy smell,sometimes stronger than others I had all the washing machine and dryer out incase of leaks,Fitted sheaths over the water outlet incase it was from the drains,Disinfectant tablets in sink and loo etc Still the same Then i noticed the front cover was discoloured Took it apart and it was the same as yours When i did the utility i bought all the cheapo chinese sockets etc as it was just the utility Fitted a good quality spur and has been fine since Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestyNottm Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Don't ask me why but somehow these terminal connections on the ring mains become loose, it can also be caused by water and condensation ingress in the roof or cavity walls. My brother in law had problems with his power sockets recently, my meter indicated power on live and neutral, took all the socket covers off and 50% of the screws were loose, problem solved. The wires referred to are the indicator light and the pull cord. They usually come loose due to the current flow and 50Hz vibration of the AC mains Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted November 13, 2013 Author Share Posted November 13, 2013 I have no idea what the sparky who fitted it used. its on its own supply direct from the fuse box 45amp MCB and uses a RCD. I used a MK switch lastnight. anyway luckilly it turned out ok and no one was injured or anything. im just angry that a pleb in an estate agents just casually ignored a complaint that a swtich for a shower was broken and smelled fishy burny.... it beggars belief! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 French regs for wiring require solid wire for the lighting and mains sockets. They are very difficult to connect and I made sure the screw connectors were tightened. The problem is that if you overtighten the screws the copper cable breaks. I had several rolls of the mains wire (I can't remember the sizes) so used a lot of it on the lighting circuits. Ring mains are not allowed and each socket circuit is restricted to 6 sockets and the lighting to 8 lights. I split the house into two so each end is on a consumer unit with 16 circuits each plus 1 for the cooker. We have 3 phase supply and I've split each phase into a single phase circuit. In France the standard supply is 30 amp (it's 60 in the UK, (I think)). Only "problem" was a trip going when the socket on a lead outside running the cement mixer filled with water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 All of the above seem reasonable guesses to me but my tingly senses tell me its something else or you wouldnt be asking the question. I therefore think its was something to do with the feed for the Neon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain m Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Thank for the info regarding the 50hz vibration, I am not an electrician but electric showers and immersion heaters should be on their dedicated 20amp mcb although many are on 32 amp spurred off the ring main and I certainly would be concerned if it is on a 45 amp supply.?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted November 13, 2013 Author Share Posted November 13, 2013 surely a 20A is way to low and would trip constantly. an 8.5KW shower @230V = 36.9A using P=IV. Even the instructions say to use a 40A MCB. the circuit is correct it was assessed and certified when i had the electrical safety cert done for the rental. The guy even commented on it as he expected it to not have the RCD in place. there is nothing more to it John. I just didn't want to say anything at first as i wanted peoples opinion without knowing where it happened to sway any judgement. Im not convinced that it was wired properly but given it was on the ceiling and i took it down first i cannot make that call. anyway if they had shoved the wires in the wrong holes then i guess it wouldn't have worked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clansman Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Thank for the info regarding the 50hz vibration, I am not an electrician but electric showers and immersion heaters should be on their dedicated 20amp mcb although many are on 32 amp spurred off the ring main and I certainly would be concerned if it is on a 45 amp supply. ?? If it was a 6KW shower then at 240 VAC it draws 25 amps, been a while since I looked at electric showers but memory has me thinking 7.2 KW was an "average" size shower which pulls 30 Amps. What KW rating is the shower? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain m Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 Perhaps I am out of date with the date with the demands of a modern electric shower not having had one for some years. Our 6 plate 3 oven electric range cooker is fed from a huge cable ( rated 10mm) requiring only a 40 amp mcb so I would be concerned with 45amps powering an electric shower given the circumstances of the failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 big pumps (if it's a power shower) are an inductive load though, which really should be on the right type of breaker ©, but where not available, you do sometime see higher rated B type breakers in use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 I have no idea, so I'm going to guess at lightning strike 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLADDIN Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 s. Our 6 plate 3 oven electric range cooker is fed from a huge cable ( rated 10mm) requiring only a 40 amp mcb so I would be concerned with 45amps powering an electric shower given the circumstances of the failure. thats due to the applied diversity factor. tha fault above is not uncommon , cables expand contract get loose, heat up even more so on so on common on the connection lead to an electric cooker or range. i believe the uk is looking at going back to radial circuits aka france. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted November 13, 2013 Share Posted November 13, 2013 i believe the uk is looking at going back to radial circuits aka france. Not heard any of the Sparky's we work with talking about that, is it a recent rumour/development? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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