Mark (smokey mow) Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 Best driver Graham Hill who else has won F1 Championship, Indy 500, & Le mans. I'd agree, but also using similar logic I would say John Surtees. No other has won a world championship on both two and 4 wheels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Everall Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 In 2009 the TIMES voted Jim Clark the best F1 ever Twice world champion at F1 Drove F1,F2, Indy 200, sports cars and touring cars Won 25 Grand Prix and had 33 Pole positions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted October 27, 2013 Author Share Posted October 27, 2013 What about before F1? Doesn't the real racers in real cars count (ducks). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M444TTB Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 Bunch of hoorays with more money than sense Norm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff oakley Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 This one of those questions that is impossible to say unless you go to silly lenghts to try to give marks. There are people mentioned so far who are so old only Norm remembers then so it is hard for those who never saw them to decide. There is also the era that they drove in, the quality of the competiton and the gap between the machinery at the time that all is hard to quantify. If I had to say, I would say Jim Clarke and Graham Hill were up there as whatever car they drove they were able to get more out of them than most. This was at a time that they could drive saloon cars one day, rally cars the next as well as F1. Modern era, much harder to call as there is Senna, Prost, Schumacer and now Alonso and Vettle. The first three all won in cars that were not the best, and certainly Alonso has wrung the neck of his car, which they know is crap, to get podiums all year where others would have been unable to do that. So until we have seen Vettle in a car without such a clear advantage over the rest then it is hard to say he is the best. If in the next couple of years the car isn't so much better and he still wins then he will be on his way to being seen as an all time great. I watched a program on TV and it was said that Vettle is different to other drivers as he gets involved with the team at a much closer level. When Pirelli got the F1 gig, he went to the factory where they were made, to learn and understand but also to build relationships. That is a big thing imho as Clark and Hill both could weild the spanners and did so many times to help. Love him or hate in greatest or not he has the heart of a racer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatbaldbloke Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 So until we have seen Vettle in a car without such a clear advantage over the rest then it is hard to say he is the best. Don't forget his first win was in a Toro Rosso. I do agree with much that Jeff wrote. F1 is now a team event, it's very hard to separate the driver's contribution from the designers, quality control, logistics, mechanics, etc, they all play their part. Also the best drivers tend to end up driving for the best teams. In terms of who is the best I'm going to say Fangio with the option to replace him with Vettel in 4 or 5 years time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M444TTB Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 Based on many anti-Vettel arguments Fangio isn't much good either. What with his horrible tendency to get into the best cars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pistonbroke Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 Fangio performed some remarkable feats before he came in to F1 like Winning Pan America race series, 1000 odd mile races driven single handed , fantastic stamina and concentration required , he only came in to F1 late in life . Jim Clark drove everything and anything , was a winner in sports cars , british saloon champion , Indy 500 . He would have won 4 back to back world championships had the Lotus car not been so fragile . Who knows how many more he would have won had he not been so tragically taken from us , so soon New Zealander Chris Amon was one of the best drivers ever , yet he never won a single grand Prix ! Moss never won a world championship yet he was a legend in his own time , his ambition was to win the championship in a privately entered car , he came very close on several occasions . Innes Ireland was one of my hero's drove all sorts in any kind of race walked away from some enormous crashes yet always raced on with the same enthusiasm and a great personality Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Hurdsfield - Joint Manchester AO Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 No one's mentioned 'Our Nige', he knew how to get the crowd behind him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pistonbroke 2 Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 No one's mentioned 'Our Nige', he knew how to get the crowd behind him. What a whinger Mansell was. Still he was a ballsy driver thats for certain. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cast iron Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Glad someone mentioned Mansell, beat Senna and Prost on many occasion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLADDIN Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Glad someone mentioned Mansell, beat Senna and Prost on many occasion and a few yanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Aspden Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Got to be Gilles... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Banks Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 SWMBO is the best driver - so I'm told. Back on topic though, it's all very emotive unless there are clear definitions of what the best GP driver should be. I imagine also that apart from the greats of old, the best GP driver "ever" has yet to be discovered... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted October 28, 2013 Author Share Posted October 28, 2013 I would say that a good driver is one that can take an inferior car on the grid and still win. I appreciate that this is probably impossible now so maybe we should put the others in Vettel's car to see who can beat his lap times. It's all theory based. Nuvolari is my "best" driver as he consistently drove faster than others even when using an inferior car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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