BMW servicing

[Nick PC]

Firstly this is not a knock at the quality of the attention you and car receive as is light years ahead of some other marques. But for the first time I saw the cost of an oil change £270. This included £130 for 7.2l of Shell Helix Ultra. Quick search shows 20l barrel for £108. Glad BMW pick the cost up through service pack, but what is the cost of that. Ouch!!

[XTR2Turbo]

Look at what land rover charge if you want to see a rip off. Official oil and filter change on a discovery is £420

It's got to the point I would only buy another new car now if it had the option of all inclusive servicing package like BMW or mini

I'd like to be brave enough to just do it myself but would worry about warranty and resale impact

[peterg]

Just did an oil and filter change of the Ferrari Coupe    this week, total = just under £15  (thanks to Halfords 4ltr 10w40 semi-synth for £10 and filter from GSF for £4.49 delivered)

[Marto303]

No issues with warranty David so long as you use genuine parts, we do it all the time. 

[Nick PC]

Peter What about a change on the moped?

[peterg]

I just used the oil out of the mower for that       

[XTR2Turbo]

No issues with warranty David so long as you use genuine parts, we do it all the time. 

 Doesn't it have to be carried out by a VAT registered garage also?

 

Added complication is that Landrover are using a 'special' Castrol oil that at the moment you can only buy from dealers.

 

I rang around and got it done for £360 but still a rip off.

[XTR2Turbo]

A quick google suggests that there are also other factors to consider.

 

Lot's of main dealers won't now take a car in part exchange if it doesn't have main dealer service history.

 

Also EU law only applies to up to 3 year warranty.

 

You won't be able to keep a 5 or 7 year warranty e.g. from KIA with non dealer servicing and you won't be able to extend manufacturer warranty either.

 

If you look at the terms of some company lease cars it stipulates main dealer servicing or a £1500 penalty at end of lease !! Merc do this now.

[Nick PC]

Company car always goes to main dealer, but personally owned cars go to local motor engineer who knows me and does not just rely on fault codes and replace all parts in turn. Very lucky to chance upon him

[Marto303]

Well all I can add is that we look after a number of new / newish cars both company and privately owned and have never (yet) had an issue with a warranty claim being rejected.

 

We have a customer who owned a VW Passat from new, which we serviced from new with geniune parts, 10,000 miles before it was due for replacement the cam belt failed. After inspection of the service history (ours) and providing copy invoices the local VW dealer fitted a new engine without hesitation under warranty.

[Norman Verona]

Marty, not having a go at you, good luck.

 

However when a customer books a VAG vehicle into the dealer the VIN is checked on the VAG main computer and a list of warranty jobs are listed. It may be new wheel bearing or other parts replaced. They do this when they have history of early failures of a component and I suppose you could call it preventative maintenance.

 

I had a discussion with a VW/Audi main dealer not far from you a few years ago. I asked him how he justified £110 per hour labour charge. The answer was that in the first 3 years the servicing time was 4 hours. so the difference was about £200 over 3 years. He also said that in that 3 years the warranty work carried out without the owners knowledge could be in the thousands.

 

Please don't shoot the messenger.

[jeff oakley]

These are the sort of issue that the dealers like to maintain to scare people into using them for extortionately priced servicing.

 

In my job I have worked with the Department of transport via the after market group IAAF. The manufacturers spend millions lobbying to try to keep secrets from the aftermarket. This was the reason that Block exemption came about to force them to divulge the information so that servicing could be done in the aftermarket, without any effect on the warranty.

 

They have tried every dirty trick in the book, wrapping information in the "security ECU" for example to try to avoid giving coding information out.

 

The simple facts are these, if you have your car serviced, as per the schedual, using parts of equivalant quality to the OE, then any attempt to refuse warranty claims is illegal and puishable by heafty fines.

 

This year two manufacturers have been taken to task over claims made in adverts by the IAAF suggesting you can only have servicing done at dealers and have withdrawn them.

 

In the case of Kia, if the standard warranty package is 7 years, again they cannot refuse on the grounds of servicing. If it is a standard three years, plus a further 4 as an extra then they can.

 

As for the devaluation of resale, many of the biggest lease companies are now sending cars to be serviced outside the dealer network, as they have experts who can see there is no justification in £270 for an oil change, when the oil is being charged at double the market rate, so as they account for a huge percentage of cars in the secondhand arena, they don't see it as an issue.

 

And the truth is simple, if you take your car for a service at a dealer, the lowest qualified person in the building is likely to do it. If it is identified as having extra work needed then a technician will be given that work to do.

 

Every one has a choice, if you are happy to spend twice as much on servicing then go ahead, but there is no need functionally or legally to do so.

 

All parts suppliers can provide details of the block exemption status of their parts in a written form if needed.

[Norman Verona]

Jeff, it may be the way you've worded it but Block Exemption was withdrawn. It was the block exemption allowed by the EU for the motor manufacturers to run franchises which was against the EU anti-competitive rules. I know you know that.

 

Many dealers think they're worse off now as contracts have replaced the previous franchise rules which mean the dealer has less security. Many of the smaller dealers are becoming independent. 

 

I think the service charges are set high to encourage the sale of service contracts. Having been a dealer you sell a car for next to no profit and then have no control over getting that car back into the workshop where you can make a decent living. Service contracts tied to a dealer is one way to keep the customer in the workshop.

 

Actually I got out of the dealer business mainly for that reason. All my customers now pay us every month, they have no choice unless thay change systems and that will, to get the same level, cost them much more.

[jeff oakley]

Yes the dealers are now in a very unsecure place with the demands of the manufacturers. Look at any Audi dealerships, they are all in identikit buildings with huge overheads, for example and the margins on new cars are much lower than before. Warranty rates paid do not cover the true costs of repairs as you well know, a warranty time can be well divorced from the actual time taken, so all the dealers are trying to branch out in other areas of cash revenue.

 

The block exemption as you point out was origannaly dealer related but it has changed and is still in force, the extract from Wikipedia sums it up basically,

 

Block Exemption Regulation is an exemption in a business line or industry, which debars organizations in the industry from some business activities in order to create competition. The regulation is highly known in the automobile industry due to the effect caused by the BER regulations from the European Commission.^[1][2] BER has changed the automobile industry in the last decade.^[3] Prior to 2003 automobile owners in the EU region risk nullifying their vehicle warranty when the vehicles were serviced or repaired in workshops not belonging to the vehicle manufacturer or its dealers. This barrier was broken in October 2003, when the European Commission (EC) passed a law allowing vehicle owners the freedom of having their servicing and repairs done at their chosen workshop.^[4]

 

This is what the current situation is.

[Norman Verona]

I'm not defending the dealers only trying to explain why they make these very high charges. When I was running dealerships, I had a 4 to 1 ratio of mechanics to workshop admin staff.

The manufacturers now demand certain procedures that mean dealers have a 1 to 1 ratios, in some cases more admin staff than mechanics. In some franchises our computer system will do most of the admin work for no extra cost or staff but they are still forced to do it all manually.

I used to get 17.5% discount on cars and 20% on commercial vehicles. Now the dealer gets 3%. They can top this up with various bonuses but even so the margins are pitiful. To put that in perspective shoes have 300% mark up. If the shoe costs £10 it retails for £30. Clothing is similar.

The other side of the coin is that the dealers would give 90% of the margin away in discounts which led the manufacturer to cut the discount and encourage the dealer to retain more of it's margins.