chris678 Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 Can anbody recommend somewhere close to Maidenhead where I can get the suspension set up correctly on my Westfield. The car is a 1990 SE. I used it at a trackday for the first time last week and the back end was sliding all over the place while the Caterhames were just shooting past me on the bends. Tyres at the moment are new Pirellis at 20psi. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordy Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 Hi chris, Theres a chap in woodley, Neil Hatton know him, other than that a trip to playskool in the midlands would be the best bet. Did you get your exhaust changed, or did the track measure a different db reading?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s.stirley Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 May sound simple - but have you got decent tyres on the back ? there's very little weight there on a Westy so you really need all the grip you can get, which means decent tyres and as large a contact patch as you can maintain. I would expect very little body roll so there's not a lot other than toe-in that would effect the back. 20psi sounds a little low. Was it sliding _all_ the time, or only under power, or only when lifting the power ? 99% of powerful rear-drive cars I've driven need very careful balancing of the throttle to maintain the grip at the back. Amazing how slippy race-tracks feel isn't it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s.stirley Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 Sorry, you said new Pirelli's .. so should be decent for grip. When was it sliding though ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studbuckle Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 20psi sounds a little low. Nope, sounds about right to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris678 Posted April 25, 2003 Author Share Posted April 25, 2003 Did you get your exhaust changed, or did the track measure a different db reading?? Managed to get a new exhaust on the saturday and changed it on the sunday (that's why I didn't get to the Club meet on Sunday). The car was VERY rear end happy at the beginning of the trackday but as the track and the tyres warmed up it got slightly better. Still, even in the afternoon sessions the tail was sliding out when accelerating out of corners. At one point in the afternoon I put the spare wheel back on and chucked all the tools in the boot to add some more weight over the rear tyres but to no effect. This all leads me back to the suspension setup and I'm afraid that's above my level of ability. Do you have a phone number for the guy in Woodley? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Mack Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 I'm pretty new to westfield setups so take this with a pinch of salt but I'd like to learn so...... You have an SE? Surely this means the only thing that can be adjusted at the back is ride height and shock rates? Aren't these best experimented with at a trackday to see the affect rather than setup statically? Or are you thinking of corner weighting? for what it is worth, my experience is second hand from watching a friend trying to make his locost/fireblade (live axle) handle well. Small adjustments of rear ride height and shocks made a big difference to how tail happy it is. But it is worth perservering. It has taken him maybe a dozen trackdays but he has no trouble seeing off most cars on the track now. It also appeared to depend on the driver and how used to the car he is. With his current setup he admits it is fast but complains a bit of understeer. I drove it for a session and found no understeer but a bit tail happy out of corners. He was 10mph faster down the main straight than me though Genuine questions! I've newly acquired a SE xflow and have my first trackday next Friday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studbuckle Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 There's a generally accepted base point with the SE to start from. I'd do a search because it's so many mm ride height at front and so many rear with x number of clicks on the spax front and y number of clicks on the rears. I did this to mine when I got it as it was all over the place with loads of understeer. I'm sure it can be improved on (mainly in the driver dept) but it gave me a starter for 10 and is worth doing just to see how close to that you are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samcooke Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 Here's the thread you want. FWIW, after much fiddling my 89 SE Xflow 2 clicks on the back and 4 on the front with my 539s @ 17psi cold worked best for me (little bit of understeer that can be tucked back in with a little bit of power, oversteer on demand only), didn't fiddle with the ride height... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oioi Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 like si says get it set to some well known reference points. then as (a friend of mine says) learn to drive the thing and forget set-up. im not being critical but set-up can be such a red herring, playing about with set-up will take your focus away from learning to drive. i was convinced my car was very tail happy. took all the tools down to croft for a track day to sort it. (i did play about with the dampers, but that was to get them to a known setting). i came to the conclusion that the reason my car felt tail happy was that i was over braking for the corners, and tho my line was correct i was getting on the power to hard to early and this was making the back slide. i massively reduced my braking point and increased the braking force until i was locking up. the car then felt a lot more neutral cos i couldnt get on the power so early. was even managing to get the front to wash out at times. its still very twitchy at the back on the power but that is 215bhp and only A539 tyres. personally i find the hardest thing to do is brake late. its a real leap of faith to leave the braking that late. getting on the power is easy cos who doesnt like the feel of going round with the hanging out and loads of oppositte lock? the friend who always said forget set-up once it is near came second racing a 1400cc in the upto 1800cc in the scottish series. he didnt change his setup from event to event, he just concentrated on driving. makes a #### of a lot of sense if you ask me. mike (apologies if any of this is granny and eggs time) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Yupright Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 There's a generally accepted base point with the SE to start from. I'd do a search because it's so many mm ride height at front and so many rear with x number of clicks on the spax front and y number of clicks on the rears. I did this to mine when I got it as it was all over the place with loads of understeer. I'm sure it can be improved on (mainly in the driver dept) but it gave me a starter for 10 and is worth doing just to see how close to that you are With an SE, I would set the rideheight such that the trailing arms for the axle are horizontal. (with the driver on board) If you dont do this: As the car rolls, the trailer arms will effectively lengthen on one side, and shorten on the other, hence causing rear wheel steer. Quite how pronounced this effect is I dont know, but it depends on the length of the trailing arms, and the Westfield ones are fairly short. If you set the trailing arms to horizontal, it doesnt happen. Because if you move up or down, it effectively shortens the arms. (rather than one side lengthening, one side shortening). Interesting effect though. Cheers, Al. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordy Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 Do you have a phone number for the guy in Woodley? Dont have a number im afraid - you could try email Neil and asking him where he took it - all i know is that is was in woodley and it was £100 or so. neil@n-hatton.demon.co.uk cheers Chris Out of interest, what silencer did you get and what db reading did it give at the track. also, isnt you car up for sale on Findit.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris678 Posted April 25, 2003 Author Share Posted April 25, 2003 Got the Silencer from: http://www.nfauto.co.uk/silencers.htm Absolutly top bloke to deal with. It gave a reading of 97.4 at Castle Coombe. Yup, it's my car on Findit. Put it there to hedge my bets if I can't get the handling any better on the Westfield. I used to have a c******m about 8 years ago that I used solely for trackdays for 2 years but sold it due to illness. Finally better now so brought the Westfield as a cheap way of doing trackdays again. Could be I've made a mistake buying the Westfield but like they say.....you only get what you pay for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordy Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 97db is much more repsectable A properly setup westfield will handle just as well as a c******m. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison Posted April 25, 2003 Share Posted April 25, 2003 If you set the rear arms parallel, with the driver on board, as you go around a bend they will both shorten by the same amount (not one lengthen and one shorten) - as one goes up around the radius point, the other goes down, thus the lengths being equal. To get rear wheel steer effect, the arms need to be angled down towards the chassis from the axle. this is usually the case when the rear ride height is lower than the front ride height or equal to it. if the car oversteers, lower the rear ride height by 2 turns of the spring platforms each side until the desired efffect occurs. Also, slacken off the shock absorbers to their lowest setting and set to approx 2 clicks each side. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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