shocks too low,sitting too high?

[Blatman]

Some folk will be happy with the "standard" ride height, some won't. I don't think it's necessarilly the factory's fault, and calculating and offering all the different possible options would be a real headache.

The 18Kg's "lever action" is only a couple of feet from the centre of the wishbone pickups, so whilst it is having an effect it's not having that much of an effect. It certainly won't be making the difference between having the correct ride height or not.

[Peter M]

But what concerns me i cannot get the car to a "standard factory height "  with standard factory parts unless i lower spring platforms down which will give some slack in springs which i have been assured by mark thats how the standard factory cars are.Then if this is the case there must be cars out there that have loose springs.

[nikpro]

Peter,

I don't think the spare will make much difference; I regularly take mine off and the ride height is not altered.

I agree that it seems strange that identical spec cars seem to be different; mine was fine on the Gaz shocks and springs from the factory.

[Blatman]

I agree that the advice, in my opinion, to run a car with springs that can potentially fall off their platforms, is questionable. And I understand your frustration I really do...

If the factory can't help with an offer to supply shorter shocks in exchange for what you have, then you have two options as I see it. Either follow the factory advice and just lower away, with the subsequent issue of potentially loose springs at full droop, or sell the shocks you have on here or Ebay and buy some new ones with the proceeds that are a more appropriate length.

[Jenko]

OK, lets look at this in a different way....My car was built in 2000, but I believe bought in 98/99. So, I'm fairly certain it will be the same chassis...

I have bought exactly the same shocks as you (14" rear, 12.5 Front), and I measured previous shocks to the same length. So lets assume you have the correct length.

My car runs 145mm at the rear, and 125 at the front, I'm measuring the rear from the unerside of the main chassis cross member on the flat of the car (in the middle). I had no issues whatsoever getting the correct ride height, and my springs do not go slack when the car is jacked up.........

So, (again assuming this is all correct) I see that the only variable is wheel size and springs...I have 15" wheels with 195 / 55 tyres, and I'm guessing you have something similar.

Now the only thing I don't know is my spring size, as Kevin at Protech supplied them without me asking for a specific length. I really think this may be your problem, your springs are too long. 175mm ride height sounds too high, and you should not have to put up with this, as it's important that your westfield performs to it's best. So I would certainly look  into different springs.....you may want to call Protech and ask Kevin what he supplied to Paul (chap from Southampton who recently popped in to pick up his shocks)...He should remember me as we chatted for over an hour....Hopefully he will also know what size springs he supplied me as they seem perfect. Got to be worth a shot.....

Paul.

[Blatman]

Good shout on wheel/tyre sizes. I don't think we've covered that in this discussion yet, and as you say, that will have an effect to a greater or lesser degree...

[Peter M]

All advice taken on board but is it a spring issue or a shock issue.Paul says his shock length is the same as mine so his difference maybe length/poundage,or you say Blatman shorter shocks,im a bit confused which to change.

195/50/15

[Blatman]

If, to get the ride height you want, the springs go loose, you need shorter shocks.

With the amount of spring adjustment available on shocks usually fitted to Westfields, a spring would have to be *really* short to be too short.

If you want, I can write up how you go about determining shock length the "proper" way. It's a bit of a faff to actually do, but it shouldn't take more than 4 or 5 hours to do the measuring for both front and rear ends.

Spring length is much easier to determine as it is dependent on shock length.

[Peter M]

If you want, I can write up how you go about determining shock length the "proper" way. It's a bit of a faff to actually do, but it shouldn't take more than 4 or 5 hours to do the measuring for both front and rear ends.

Spring length is much easier to determine as it is dependent on shock length.

Exellent.

[Jenko]

I guess it stands to reason that if your open shock length is the same as the old spax (and assuming the ride height was ok with the spax, then it must be spring  length (espically now it seems you have normal size whells and not 'pimp my ride' 22" spinners).

From what I see here, you are approx 30mm too high on the loosest setting, so, a reduction of an inch in spring lenght should bring you down to the correct level.

Again, it would be prudent to do a full check as per Blatmans advice, as I'm sure you want to get this right...

Also worth noting, when I fitted my shocks, I had advice on the amout of clicks (two to three was advised)...I tried this and found the car too soft and was prone to hitting the bump stops too easily...I playaround a fair bit with the damper settings and settled on 6 clicks on the rear. But, point is....make sure you play around with the settings as it makes a massive difference.

[boris77]

I lowered the spring platform as low as it would go as an experiment and I still couldn't get the ride height down to the magical 6 1/4" as the manual says. It was also ridiculously slack. I measured the spring length, its 9". The original westy one, which is too long for the protech shock came in around 10 1/2".  It does look like the 14" protech shock is just too long for the ride height I want, although the 14" spax were fine.

I'm currently sitting on 13" wheels 185/70. Although I'm looking to move to 15" wheels shortly.

Blatman:

From another thread I see a way of measuring the length of shock required. Take the shock out (leaving wheel on) get the ride height you want,measure the distance between the mount points. Jack up so you have full droop, measure the distance again and do some simple math. Is this the method you were talking about when you mentioned measuring it up the correct way?

Thanks

[Blatman]

From what I see here, you are approx 30mm too high on the loosest setting, so, a reduction of an inch in spring lenght should bring you down to the correct level.

But the spring seat is adjustable, so to avoid a loode spring you adjust up the seat and you're back to square one, IE a shock that, when on full extension with a nipped up spring, is too long. Just shortening the spring opens up the potential for an unseated spring on full droop, which *I* think should be avoided at all costs.

[Blatman]

Hi Boris.

You found it whilst I was typing it. Good boy

[boris77]

Cheers Blatman  Excellent

I found a tyre size calculator, if (I can) shift to 195/50 15" wheels I will lose 13mm in height. Which would get me to the magical 6 1/4". However I'll measure up tonight and see what the measurements say, I suspect 13" shocks would give me a bit more to play with should I decide I want it lower. I really should of done this before I ordered the shocks, doh!

Measure twice, order once.

[Blatman]

Don't worry about it. My sprint car is on it's 3rd set of shocks. Every time I try a new tyre size (sometimes voluntary, sometimes because of the rules) I need to fiddle with ride heights, droop and spring rates... Oh, the joy...