DickieB Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 If I'm racing I want to put 100% of my race day time into racing Oooops. I thought it was supposed to be fun! I enjoy chatting, spectating, food, ice creams and all sorts of other things. Maintaining the car is something that shouldn't need to be done in between practice/races (checked yes, but no need to maintain). Therefore only 100% when actually behind the wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geofff Posted October 31, 2005 Author Share Posted October 31, 2005 Hi Dickie, Okay, okay. I know I was doing the prep wrong - even I know I shouldn't be rebuilding my engine and gearbox before the first race So what made you choose the Locost instead of the WF BARC series? And was it locost? We could use your decision as an example for the meeting on the 12th. Ta Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobsy Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 Hi Geofff, You wanted to know why I switched from sprinting to circuit racing (I'm Andy Mowbray). First I'd better make clear that I didn't compete in a Westfield, although I did compete against them. There were various reasons :- Driving time, the actual time you spend behind the wheel, At Curborough, my home track, a days sprinting would involve just over 2 minutes driving time. A days racing will normally be 15/20 minutes practice and the same length race for about twice the cost. Cost of the car. I wanted to compete in a class were success depended more on the skill of the driver than the depth of your wallet. Hence I liked the idea of sealed engines and control tyres, I know it's not a true level playing field but it comes close. Someone mentioned earlier that there were many SS cars that would be quicker round a track than the Championship cars, that's undoubtably so, but mixing them in, would spoil the racing. My car has just over 160bhp (I think), if I get beaten by someone driving a Westfield with 250bhp what does that prove? 250bhp is generally faster than 160bhp. Lastly, I wanted more of a challenge than sprinting. Sprinting is a more clinical discipline where every gearchange and braking point has to be exact. Racing on the otherhand is much more emotional, freeform, expressive, raw, I'm not sure of the right term but in a race you've got much more to think about than just taking the fastest line, you're battling against other drivers at the same time. Socialising, you'd be surprised how much goes on. Not formally with get-togethers in the local pub but informally with helping one another out when you have problems. Drinks in one of the more fortunate competitor's motorhomes on a Saturday night of a double header. You'd probably also be surprised how the rivalry is kept to the track, as an example, during qualifying at Croft Nick Sinfield spun coming out of Sunny an hit the barrier with the rear of his car. Nick, Troy, Didier, myself all pitched in to help, Paul Taberner leant a new rear wing and Nick successfully took to the grid for the race. Finally, racing takes much more out of a car and driver than sprinting and any competitor will find that quite a lot of the time between qualifying and the race will be taken up in checking and repairing his car. I seem to have gone on quite a bit but in conclusion I'd say I would accept two classes, the current 1.8 Zetec cars and a Duratec class, but I wouldn't support a free-for-all where anything goes. Would I go back to sprinting? No, I'd miss the wheel to wheel battles, the driving round the outside of competitors at Sears and being driven around on the outside at Gerards while I'm at full throttle. Andy Mowbray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DickieB Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 I agree with almost everything Andy has said. Except Locost is genuinely social as well - BBQs, drinks, off-season karting etc. I couldn't afford the Westfield racing - everything was more expensive, albeit only slightly, but all those "slightly"s start adding up to a lot! I have to say that I did not do a lot of research, but I believe that Locost racing is incredibly close, very cheap (cheaper than Speed Series), a good social, and great fun. Would I go for Locost again? (in a few years when I move out of London....) possibly. I would look harder at what was around, but it is likely to be Locost or Westfields depending on the format at the time. I would "much" prefer a single class format. I've never felt that the Locosts needed more power to be fun, but I would prefer better tyres that don't go off 10 mins into a 15 min race (road-going Yoko 539s were never designed for it - it's not their fault). Happy to help anyone thinking of going into Locosts - I've prepared a couple of pages of useful info/thoughts etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 Whoa everyone please. I'm feeling all beaten up Don't be Geoff - I think we'd all like to see the BARC championship back up there with more folks having a go whatever format / classes it decides upon - the drivers deserve a higher profile and more folks joining in Look at Caterham grads etc - why not something similar - they manage to have various classes appealing to various pocket depths - BARC Just needs to raise the profile and have full support and back-up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starter Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 I've enjoyed watching some of the Westfield races this year and hope you find a way of strengthening the grids further. I currently race in the caterham Grads but a few comments for what they might be worth. ( all IMHO of course) 1) Racing is about having close battles with as many racers as possible so keeping the cars the same and with as tighter control as possible is important ( and keeps the cost down) So we have different grids for different specs and all engines are sealed. We even do some dyno checks just to make sure its an even playing field. 2) The social side is a big plus ( we've got about 90 racing members and about 40 social members) Probably the most important decision was to provide food/coffee/tea etc for all drivers and support crew and marshals at all of the races. This really acts as a focal point, gets everyone chatting and also means it's easy for prospective members to find someone to talk to) Most of the guys knock around together and have a good time/ help each other out and if anything it builds up a bit more trust on the track although it doesn't mean the racing itself is any less hard. 3) The club provides technical support at all test and race days. Not only does this improve your chances of getting a full race weekend ( a gearbox change between qualifying and racing would not be uncommon) but it also means that people who are not that great mechanically feel a lot more comfortable. 4) We have our own driving standards team ( active race members) who ensure that new drivers know what is expected and also ensure that careless driving is dealt with. The club is not actually connected to caterham at all- it's just run by members for members but the management team try to consult as far as possible so there are a couple of meetings a year at races and members are also surveyed on where they want to race, number of rounds, length of races etc. It doesn't please all of the people all of the time but gnerally people feel they know what's going on and have had a chance to input. Good luck for 2006 guys and hope your series goes from strength to strength MikeW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geofff Posted November 1, 2005 Author Share Posted November 1, 2005 Hi All, I'll take a copy of this along to the meeting And try and get the points raised for discussion. It'll be interesting to see what happens on the 12th! It's a pity WF didn't make a more open invitation to WSCC members & potential racers generally because input from non-BARC competitors (or future BARC competitors?) is essential for increasing grid sizes - rather like exit interviews at a work to find out why people leave - perhaps we need interviews of people who didn't choose WF BARC - like DickieB. Also interesting to list the reasons why people did enter (Andy above). So general points raised so far (in no particular order & left open as to solution for meeting on 12th): 1) More integration between all WF motorsport activities - especially to the Speed Series 2) Increase awareness of BARC series 3) Social activity (informal at the moment) more formally organized 4) Technical support trackside - especially useful (confidence building) for newbie WF builder / racers 5) Decision on future formula direction for people thinking of entering - builds take time / panning Any points I've missed? I'll edit to this post and take them along to the meeting Ta Geoff P.S. One thing I could do (which wouldn't eat into my prep time on race day too much) is coffee & croissants between qualifying & race. Forty peeps worth I could do not a problem. Disposable cups / four cafetiere's and an urn / boiler connected to generator plus clean out my local baker before I leave for the weekend. Maybe bring an old microwave, connect to generator again, to warm up the croissants. Sound reasonable or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAT1800 Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Sorry to but in.....But I thought you might appreciate a Newbies point of view regarding how you get more people invloved in the race series, sorry if you don't I am a complete novice with no racing experience what so ever, although I have been karting a few times. I have just finished a 'madness kit' . Which I bought and built because it was offered as a complete kit, I didn't have to worry about unexpected costs or incompatable parts etc etc. I knew what I was going to get and how much it would cost me. As it it at the moment, I don't know the difference between BARC and SS, I don't know what different classes are avaliable, or how to enter. I know I could find out the answers to all of this, but my point is that perhaps WF should help to organise a simple way of informing all WSCC members what is avaliable and how to get involved. I have owned my kit for 3 years now, and it's been on the road for 3 months, and I have not recieved a single letter or flyer telling me about what options are avaliable and how to get invloved. If it wasn't for this section on the website I'm not sure I'd even know what race series existed! I'm NOT loaded and as with everyone there are always a million different ways to spend your hard earned cash, however if I had a flyer saying come to this track on this day, it'll cost you £200, you get to go around the track a few times with an experienced driver, followed by a track session with other novices, and then Mr X will explain all the different race series options avaliable and how to get invloved, and approximate costs.. I'd be there in a flash... The reason's being, I want to race but don't know how to go about it, I wonder if I could afford it, or ever afford it (I'm 29)I don't know if my car would be sutiable? How often would we meet, what about when work gets in the way? also as a small business owner in the future could I organise through my company, a team that invloves all the guys at work. Not just for the team building, staff motivation reasons, would there be a commercial benefit in this ie through advertising, what coverage do the race series get, how have other small companies found it. What help and support is avaliable. ETC ETC ETC ETC ETC. All of this could be answered during an 'introduction to racing day'. Just my point of view... Mat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
custardtart Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 I'm racing in the 750MC Kit Car series (Class B Zetecs) next season and have looked closely at the BARC Westfield Champs. For me I only have to make small alterations to my car but as someone said earlier, all the little costs add up over a season and BARC is more expensive in every aspect. Having said that I would love to race against a grid of only westies but the real pull for me is the chance to race against all sorts of different cars. I love the fact someone can turn up in a lime green Marlin Roadster with a great big V8 and come thundering past on the straights then be left for dead under braking and through the bends - variety really is the spice of life I've set a goal to win a race in Kits then I will have another look at the BARC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 For the Speed Series the WSCC have produced a Beginners Guide especially for folks such as Matt 1800 downloadable from the SS pages at www.wscc.co.uk Is there something similar for BARC ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geofff Posted November 1, 2005 Author Share Posted November 1, 2005 Westfield Sportscars Motorsport Index But you just know you have a problem when the Diary is showing dates for 2004 on the first page BARC link page But the BARC have a lot of formulae that they have to highlight. WF series may be getting lost in the detail I think As Mat has highlighted - the most likely candidates for WF racing are WF owners! So they need contacting / educating to the possibilities. And to answer your question Mat - the Speed Series is probably your best bet Actually I'm not so down about that as I believe car racing (unless you're seriously loaded) is never the best first step. How about endurance pro karting if there is a team of you? Or Club 100 TKM's if you "feel the need for speed" and like sprinting individually? Or track daying. Or on the other hand ring me and I'll bore for England on the subject for FREE! I mean I've been introducing myself to motorsport for over 10 years and I'm still a beginner Ta Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon4007 Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Troy from Northampton Motorsport has made an nice addition to his website recently click here Let not forget that Troy and Steve do a great job supporting all the BARC Westfield guys, and for the past season have attended all the championship rounds to provide technical and spares support on behalf of westfield. Cheers Simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geofff Posted November 1, 2005 Author Share Posted November 1, 2005 Hi Simon, Nice page. I thought Troy just did that of his own back - which I thought was damn good business sense - rather than as 'official' representative for the Factory? And yes NMS do a very good job which is why I'll be heading back for another RR session sometime soon. Should be running the engine in again this weekend Ta Geoff P.S. Simon, do you know what Seamus decided to do regarding his engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon4007 Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Simon, do you know what Seamus decided to do regarding his engine? Yes, I do know.... he's bought a ex Stewart Linn race engine that had recently been rebuilt at Dunnell. It is not however I believe a 'Dunnell engine' in the true sense. Click here With regard to Troy and NMS I think your right in so much as he doesn’t get any reward from Westfield for his efforts! I hope that it pays for it's self in referred work that he gets from the drivers, he's nice and local for me so he's going to get my business this winter. Cheers Simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnsubaru Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Hi Guys Is there a mailing list in existence for the drivers so we are notified of events such as these??? As this is the first i heard of a meeting at Westfield. Is it open to all drivers??? Cheers John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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