"Dob em in" with your Dashcam

[John K]

All four police forces in Wales are to start using dashcam footage recorded by the public to investigate driving offences following a successful pilot scheme by North Wales Police.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-40998946

Although I hope they are a bit more deserving than this... "There was a woman who went through a green light and hit a car" (should it have been "red light" or "was hit by a car")

And I was interested to read this following a members post of a nadger in an R8

"Members of the public are also told not to post it on social media, or to remove it if it has already been posted.", I remember at the time there was discussion as to if it should be removed from YouTube or not - this seem to suggest best not to post them up.

Where do we stand?

Personally I don't have a problem with it although I wonder if the police are ready for the volume of innocuous footage they will receive along the lines of "he was CLEARLY doing 32 in a 30" and if the chaff will stop them acting on the wheat...

[DamperMan]

Ummm... scarey thought.   There are so many car drivers on the road who are Road hogs.    They drive slow and take umbridge at anyone which over takes them.  These folk would love to be able to report progressive drivers.  

[jeff oakley]

I have a big problem with this to be honest. In the first place the police are using the public to spy on others and do their job and the police who did this the best was the Stasi in East Germany and look how we all thought that was wrong.

Second, we have cameras in all our vans and every so often we get sent footage saying how our vans did this etc. When we get our footage and then view it is tells a different story completely. Sometimes we have witnessed such appalling actions by other drivers who seem to be deliberately provoking situations to occur.  If this footage was not available I could well imagine our drivers having difficulty proving innocence if an edited version was sent in.

It is the thin end of a potentially big wedge, how long before they try to accept evidence from "local speed watch groups" or from concerned citizens using hand held cameras gathering evidence on their pet hates or against someone they dislike.

Sure for a serious incident there could be justification, but as I saw with the first pilot there was an emphasis on getting people onto courses where there is a financial incentive to those involved in running awareness courses.

This does not mean I want a free for all on the roads, but the headlong rush into slapping cameras up everywhere led to traffic police numbers being slashed and on the motorways replaced by HATO's, those are the people we need not Doris in her Micra with a cheap Argos camera.

 

 

[Blatman]

6 hours ago, John K said:

Members of the public are also told not to post it on social media, or to remove it if it has already been posted.", I remember at the time there was discussion as to if it should be removed from YouTube or not - this seem to suggest best not to post them up.

I think this has more to do with evidence being sub-judice. A defendant could argue that he cannot get a fair trial if the video has been released to the public and the footage possibly pre-judged by members of the jury. I'm pretty sure even a half decent lawyer wouldn't let this get within a hundred miles of a court room.

 

1 hour ago, jeff oakley said:

I could well imagine our drivers having difficulty proving innocence if an edited version was sent in.

Drivers don't have to prove innocence. In a court of Law it is up to the prosecution to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

Either way, how many cases do we think the CPS will actually be able to prosecute? I believe they are having trouble with their case loads as it is. Add in the number of people likely to want to use legal aid to fight their case and this will blow over for all but the most serious/most obvious breaches of motoring law.

[dombanks]

1984

[Rhett Turner - Black Country AO]

I think any video evidence should only be viewed if accompanied by the preceding 10 - 15 minutes of footage so that any incidents can be seen in full context.

I'm sure some of the incidents I've seen show the over reaction of one driver because of the bad driving of another. The over reaction is not acceptable but the provocation also needs to be taken into consideration. It's all too easy to provoke a reaction from another motorist edit the footage to remove your offensive driving and then submit.

[DonPeffers]

My very thought Rhett having come across agent provocatuers before (Not the lingerie brand BTW).

[Lyonspride]

It is true that many drivers are what can best be described as "passive-aggressive", doing nothing overly wrong, but deliberately aggravating other drivers to get a reaction.

 

As for dashcam footage, the West Mercia Police have basically said they don't want it, even going as far as saying (in vague terms) that they'll first look for ways to prosecute the dashcamer before the offending driver.

[Blatman]

Perfect reason why this won't work. The footage is what it is. The issues are that we don't see the cyclists perspective and the video is posted to Facebook and the press are reporting it which guarantees it'll never get to court even if a court hearing was warranted because there's no way impartiality can be guaranteed.

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/apos-unbelievable-apos-blackpool-road-115123788.html

[John K]

There seems to be consensus that folk volunteering dashcam footage just won't work but when the police want it, they are grateful for it.

About 14 months back I was 50mtrs away from a pretty nasty motorbike accident.

Totally the riders fault, he overtook on double solids, at a junction, just as a car was turning right. The rider flew about 15 mtrs with a somersault and was badly hurt. Only his leathers were keeping his leg attached. Air ambulance, road closed for 3 hours, me given a yellow jacket and put on traffic management duties...

When the police realised there was good dashcam footage, there were round the next night reviewing it and taking it away in a yellow evidence envelope. And for what its worth, when I asked about sharing it or posting it, they asked me not to.

And Rhett was bang on, when reviewing it at my house, they were just as interested in the previous 2 or 3 mins when the rider first overtook me and came into view. And a lot of their questions were of my perception of his behavior when I first clocked him behind me. So it isn't just about the accident...

There was a light hearted moment when the footage was reviewed and remember it also showed my speed and behavior (45 in a 60, perfect road position, breaking gap etc) and the officer started to shake his head and say "oh no, that just will not do, I'm going to have to have words with you"

I slightly panicked and was looking at the screen wondering what I had done "what did I do..?" came my response

"You were listening to Bob Seger, you need to change your musical choice" came his reply 

Anyway, end result was the rider was prosecuted for Dangerous Driving and the police said the footage was so clear and the riders actions were so stupid that they asked me to release it so they can use it in their Speed Awareness courses.

So the next time you get a slap on the wrist for speeding in the West Mercia patch and are made to watch a video, you might see my footage..!

[Lyonspride]

There's the other side of the coin here too, dashcamers who bait drivers into doing something silly, so they can report them.

I'm just waiting for the Police to knock on my door regarding overtaking on hatch markings near Blakedown, I was behind some pillock in an old van with a badly applied speed camera type sticker on the back, the clown was doing about 25mph in the village and 35 on the single lane dual-carriageway, he speeds up to 60+ when we get to two lanes (so I didn't bother to overtake) and slows back down to 35 afterwards, at this point I look in my rear view mirror and I see two large vans racing each other in the overtaking section and approaching me (now racing side by side on hatch markings) at what must be the best part of 80+ mph, fearing being caught in a van sandwich if neither backed down, I floor it around the idiot in front and once in front doing 60 I can see him fiddling with his dashcam, obviously hitting the save button.

Well I've got a dashcam too, so bring it on

It seems to me that the passive-aggressive crowd have now started using dashcams to further punish their victims and probably advertise it to cause additional aggravation.

[DonPeffers]

It never ceases to amaze me how some drivers on a 70mph dual carriageway (with no entry roads to worry about) will do 62mph when overtaking a vehicle doing 60 in the inside lane, and therefore take an age to pass, but once they are past will eventually move into the nearside lane and suddenly accelerate to about 80mph---what is wrong with these people?

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

I did report an event to the police but too late for a case to be brought. The thread is here: No footage as requested by the police. It took so long to find out the best way to report it that the mandatory two weeks would have elapsed since the event before they interviewed him. I am now not sure whether I should post the footage - it was up but I removed it. 

[Lyonspride]

Yeah, post it........... Chances are if he's got the cash to splash on an R8, then he's probably got the contacts to get off any Police charges/action anyway. Playing Golf with the right people gets you a long way in life and gives you a certain immunity to the law of the land.

 

I once caught on cam and posted a video of some nutcase in a Range Rover on a VERY expensive private plate (which was purchased for £250'000), I've been asked to remove said video on a number of occasions and my response has been something along the lines of "couldn't give a flying duck". Now if the moron wants to pay me, i'll be open to discussion............ But until then my response remains

[Blatman]

2 hours ago, Lyonspride said:

I've been asked to remove said video

Asked by whom? And for what reason?

MotCO, I wouldn't post it. In their position I wouldn't want to be judged by Youtube users based on 30 seconds of my life that I would likely regret once  I'd had the opportunity to reflect. People are stupid, me included, every so often. Sometimes we're really stupid. Every time I have been I have been glad it wasn't recorded for posterity.