MrPid Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 So I have done about a few miles since picking her up on Sunday and a few things I have noticed so far are mainly to do with the handling. Around town and at civilised speeds the car is perfect. However, if the red mist does descend and you end up pushing the car towards motorway speeds I have the fight of my life to keep it in a straight line. The car is all factory parts, built by an engineer and bought off a family than used to run a Westy race team, and this was the "civilised road car" as they put it. No expense spared and I have every confidence in the car. My first thoughts were bump steer but now thinking it could be a camber/toe in issue? I was on the motorway all the way home and it was fine up to 70mph, but any faster than it seemed to be hunting to escape the lane. Lots of tiny, minute inputs to keep it in a straight line. My other half who was following thought I was texting on the phone as it was that sort of messy. I own a full on V-Twin race bike which is very difficult to ride on the roads, but riding this compared to the Westy is a breeze, which is a worry. I have owned huge horsepower cars since I could drive so its not so much the travelling at speed, more of the stability at speed that is an issue. With trees, lampposts, other vehicles and my other half sat next to me, its not something I would want to go wrong. The car has IRS and Gaz coilovers all round. Running 15" minilites and Toyo Proxes (brand new). 3.5 Rover V8 running around 270hp from BPI Engineering. The other thing that surprised me is that there is no real sensation of speed (although I'm prob just too used to bikes). The sound of the car is epic, in fact some would say quite sexual and I would never get tired of it but having a fairly linear torque curve you only realise you are going fast when the crazy handling kicks in. So... as much as I love the car, what is the point in having a car that is not much use over 70mph?..... The other anecdote as to the speed, I followed a new XKR-S on the way home (550hp at 1700kgs) and he wanted to play, this thing was brutal, but I kept up ok. My initial thoughts were due to the differing power to weight ratios I should have been all over him like a rash, but not so.... Mixed thoughts in the first week thats for sure... any ideas to tame the beast guys? Thanks in advance, Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexander72 Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Stu, Geo set up good rubber (tyres) damper settings / corner weighting spring rates Have fun and be safe mate 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenh Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Sounds like you need to look at tyre and suspension setup. First simple thing, what Toyo Proxies are they? Are we talking of T1Rs, or R1Rs? Personally, and I know there are plenty on this boardroom who wouldn't agree with me, I would want trackday tyres on a car as light as a Westfield with the amount of torque you have. What tyre pressures are you running? If too high, then you will get the symptoms you describe. 20 psi is ample, and 18psi might be better for grip and comfort. After that, you need to find someone in your area who knows how to set up the suspension on a Westfield, to check the car over. Edited to add: My car hasn't anything like your torque, but it does have as much power, and will be quite a bit lighter. My car is as stable as anything you care to drive, at least up to 130mph (I haven't had it much over that). But then I'm not on Gaz dampers, rather matched Protecs, and I've never had anything other than list 1B trackday tyres on my wheels. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPid Posted June 25, 2015 Author Share Posted June 25, 2015 The Tyres are listed at Toyo Proxes R1R Track Day Tyres, they are almost new and I run them around 19psi. I shall have a look for someone on the south coast who knows their stuff and see if they can have a look at the set up for sure! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete g Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 something don't sound right and best get the suspension checked soon as possible . my v8 and other sprint car are stable at any speed would get the rear suspension checked also check under the rear at the diff to check no cracking in the chassis. might just need the dampers setting down to soft settings and more toe in on the front 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Everall Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 The FIRST things to check are front wheel camber and toe in as these can have a dramatic effect if wrong. I would set the tracking parallel or with slight bit of toe in ( certainly no Toe out). These are easy to check on a flat garage floor with basic tools before you spend money on checking full geo. ride heights and shock settings etc If you need a quick talk through on how to do it call me 07767836234 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexander72 Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 good advice all.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesT Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 The Tyres are listed at Toyo Proxes R1R Track Day Tyres, they are almost new and I run them around 19psi. I shall have a look for someone on the south coast who knows their stuff and see if they can have a look at the set up for sure! :-) I, and a few others, have used Tom New, in Bishops Waltham, to do a flat floor set-up and corner weights. He does get very busy and competes in the British hillclimb championship in a Gould GR55B so you may have to wait. His details can be found here http://www.new-techniques.co.uk/contactus.php 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Geo set up is such a personal thing! It may well have been set up to the personal tastes of the previous driver who liked something completely different. For example, I've always had toe out on mine since Paul at the original PlaysKool Motorsport did the gel all those years ago. On my new car, I had it on the factory setting of no toe, didn't like it one bit! Soon as I added that little bit of toe out it felt right again. (It doesn't hunt at speed either, it's very stable, but it does make it so much more eager to turn in). Regardless though, you need settings you feel comfortable with. A geo check is a good starting point, after a thorough spanner check and visual check of suspension/chassis. Also make sure there's no worn bushes/joints etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPid Posted June 25, 2015 Author Share Posted June 25, 2015 Thanks guys, Just had a quick check, chassis and suspension is all rock solid, looking at the car from the front it does look like there is a pretty hefty toe out. I'm guessing cycle wings need to come off to set any alignment gear up? Car is from York and heavy track user so back roads up there may suit this style better? Down south we have longer sweeping bends. Will definitely check out the chap in bishops Waltham I think as well :-) Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 It shouldn't normally need the wings removing, but it does depend on the gear the company uses; most have targets that can clip on the wheels without interfering with the cycle wings. A lot of front toe out will certainly promote turn in! Is it running a lot of camber too? (Just wondering if the geo has perhaps been set up for R888's or similar in the past, and not backed off a little when the R1R's went on). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPid Posted June 25, 2015 Author Share Posted June 25, 2015 Sorry I prob wasn't clear - this car has never been on track, but the previous owner had a few track cars so I'm guessing he set them up similarly?.. It had 17" alloys before but he said the ride was horrible, hence the change to minilites. Doesn't look like much camber on the wheels but don't have much to compare it to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenh Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 R1Rs at 19psi should be perfect for road use. Definitely need a set-up by someone who knows what they are doing with this type of car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLiNK Motorsport Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Take a picture of the front suspension and post it on here - the top front wishbone may be fitted incorrectly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Everall Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Top wishbones wrong way round giving wrong castor angles has been seen before and is a good point. Lets have a pic from the top looking down above the wishbones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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