List 1C tyres ?

[Lawrie]

This years MSA Blue Book includes

 

2.7. For 2016 there will be a Tyre List 1C. This will be

solely for Competition Tyres complying with EEC

Regulation 30 and intended exclusively for racing.

Some of the tyres included in the current Tyre List 1B

will move to the new Tyre List 1C.

 

How can you have a List 1B road legal tyre this year, that becomes a competition tyre next year.  Are these the G rated tyres that are banned by the EU?

 

Any ideas, as I'm about to spend a few bob, and would like the tyres to last a few years

[SootySport]

Tyres that last a few years on a Westfield ?

[Mark (smokey mow)]

They can remove tyres from the approved list at the end of the year by giving notice as in the rule below.

2.5. Tyres marked with an asterisk in Lists may be removed from the lists with effect from 31 December 2015. See Official bulletins for details. Additional tyres may be added to the lists at any time (see Official bulletins for details).

As everything in List 1B now has an asterix next to it there is a good chance IMO that all/some/most of the current list 1B may be moved to list 1C next year.

[Lawrie]

Thanks, I couldn't find the note for the asterisk.

 

All List 1B tyres are asterisked, as are a few List 1A

 

So this leads to the obvious question, will List 1C tyres be allowed in sprints and hillclimbs?, as for Roadgoing Specialist

Production Cars list 1A & 1B are required under 11.6.2. although Kit Cars etc are usually separated.  Will all list 1B tyres be scrap next Christmas. 

[Mark (smokey mow)]

the breakdown of classes and the Elegability of tyres therin is set by the club organising the event not by the MSA so its down to them to decide individually if the want to allow 1C tyres in certain classes next year.

[John Williams (Panda) - Joint Manchester AO]

please can a make a suggestion that the SS team make a recommendation for 2016 now as us amateur racers might get more than 1 season from a set of tyres.

 

cheers

 

John

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

I would not expect a big change, as organisers know how much competitors have invested in black round things   

 

It will be down more to the clubs running the events on the day, so I may yet be proven wrong.

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

please can a make a suggestion that the SS team make a recommendation for 2016 now as us amateur racers might get more than 1 season from a set of tyres.

 

cheers

 

John

 

Very difficult John as I said in my post it's down to the organisers on the day.

 

But I will make enquires, don;t expect a reply to soon, Autosport in the way.

[John Williams (Panda) - Joint Manchester AO]

Cheers Nick

[theprisioner]

This email from MSA last year, I was concerned about this some time ago.

 

Thank you for your email.

As the tyre you refer to is currently published in list 1B of the current yearbook with no astrix it will continue to be listed for 2015.

I am aware changes in regulation relating to rolling resistance where some tyres may not achieve the new minimum standard. The MSA tyre Panel is considering this issue at its next meeting in September and will be likely to introduce changes if necessary from 2016 if required.

If you require any further assistance please do not hesitate in getting in contact with me or a member of the technical team.

Best regards,

John


John Ryan, MIET

Technical Executive

Motor Sports Association, Riverside Park, Colnbrook, SL3 0HG
 

[Lawrie]

I received a response from my expert (turns out he's a Westfield owner and a scrutineer too) and he's as puzzled as I am

 

I thought all List 1B tyre in the 2015 Blue Book are asterisked.

[Paul Morcom]

Hi Lawrie,

 

The email that John (theprisoner) refers to is what was stated in the 2014 MSA Blue Book (at the time of his email) and as the 2014 Blue Book does not have the List 1B tyres asterisked then they have to be listed in 1B for 2015.  The MSA give a years warning that the tyre listing may change by asterisking the specific tyres.  

 

As you say in the 2015 MSA Blue Book they have *'d all the List 1B tyres and mention the introduction of List 1C as they do not yet know what they are doing for 2016. By *'ing all the 1B tyres the MSA are giving themselves the option to move any number of the existing 1B tyres in 2016 to 1C.

 

The WSCC Regs have a rule that allows any tyre that has been listed in 1A and 1B in the last 4 years, so from a WSCC regs perspective you are covered for a good number of years.  Where it becomes complicated is the class you can enter "on the day" where we are invited to other club's events.  It is down to the local regulations of the club running the event but makes no difference to the class you are eligible for/entered in the WSCC series.

 

So for example if a 2016 event ruled out List 1C tyres for roadgoing classes than it would push your car into a Modified Production class and you would be up against non-roadgoing cars shod with slicks.  However for a WSCC scoring perspective your time will be compared to your WSCC Class target time to calculate your WSCC points.  This also sometimes happens at events with aeroscreens, but not so often these days, where roadgoing classes require a full height windscreen - this also pushes the car out of roadgoing and into Mod Prod for the event but not for WSCC scoring.

 

It is simpler than my explanation but it was the best I could provide 

[tkm_dave]

bl**** good explanation that Paul! Very clear what the situation is for WSCC competitors

[Lawrie]

Its all as clear as mud, so I've gone to the top and I hear there should be guidance later in the year.

 

I think the 4 year rule has been knocking about for quite a time, so a set of 1Bs should be good for a few years, as the wording is usually along the lines that the tyre has to be listed in the last 4 years, so that a tyre that goes out of production (which is what's happening) its not scrap immediately.  This may have dropped out of Regs as it assumed, and may have to reinstated next year.

 

List 1C is "for Competition Tyres complying with EEC Regulation 30 and intended exclusively for racing"  and a current List 1B tyre isn't, as its E marked. 

[alexander72]

its a bit of kerfuffle this.  In reality how many sprinters go out there on old tyres up to 4 years old?  

 

I would just look at the tyres any of the fast lads/lasses have and get a set of those as near to March as possible. 

 

Tyres are the best performance enhancement you can make in the space of 15 minutes and can make even the lesser powered cars competitive.

 

invest in rubber - you wont regret it :-)