Captain Colonial Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I did speak to nick earlier in the year about bhp classes and agree that it would be impossible to police especially with switchable engine maps This is what my basic question is as well, wouldn't it be impossible to police - in an affordable way, at least? Inlet restrictors would work if all the engine types were all the same - like in NASCAR - but they're not all the same engines. So surely you'd only get reduced but still differential and unequal performance from the cars? Or am I being too simplistic? (For example, NASCAR run pushrod 5.7l V8s based on a 1960's design, naturally aspirated with four-barrel carbs and restrictor plates, but still make stupid amounts of power, around 750 bhp - it may have hillbilly roots and be low-tech compared to F1, but crude it isn't. Plus, like F1 KERS and DRS, I think restrictor plates are too artificial.) It looks to an outsider like me that the best way to ensure fair results and competitive situations at a reasonable cost is to structure the classes carefully and correctly, but without creating too many classes that results in only 1 or 2 people competing in any particular class. I don't have the answers, and I don't envy Nick et al in trying to get the answers - I just know they do a fantastic job - and James puts it very well above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FILFAN Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Yeah I'm really happy with things as they are. Tweak here and there to keep us on our toes but if it ain't broke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexander72 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 As a complete novice I actually like the fact that there is a lot of engineering freedom within the Speed Series. Power isnt everything when you can change gear ratios, diffs, or tyre sizes quite reasonably to adjust performance. Handling, geo set up, damper rates, stiffness etc all make a huge difference to those that know what they are doing - for those at my level I am just trying not to crash 90% of the time and that rather pre-occupies the mind. Budget is set by the persons means or SHMBO if they discuss such matters... Onwards and upwards :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funky munky Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 James good shout, you can borrow my tyre pressure gauge mate. Now wandering where to get a supercharger from ? has anyone done that with an XE ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexander72 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 funky - you can borrow my supercharger mate...i got mine from Stihl... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveD Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I feel sorry for nick and the speed series committee trying to please everyone top work keep it up guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FILFAN Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I feel sorry for nick and the speed series committee trying to please everyone top work keep it up guys +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexander72 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Steve, for the record I say that Nick Algar and all the commitee, organisers, marshalls, venue owners, fellow competitors do a fantastic job in providing what must be the best value, most competitive, professionally organised set up. I cant compare it to anything else but TOP JOB i say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Colonial Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I feel sorry for nick and the speed series committee trying to please everyone top work keep it up guys And another +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveD Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I can see many points that are of interest but at the end of the day whatever system or classes we run it will allways be a compromise its just a matter of picking the best compromise ,there will allways be people unhappy no matter what Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodman Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Thank you for your answer Steve I think it unlikely that many people would want to restrict their engines just to take part in the SS,(and handicap themselves at events) Also Gearboxes, Tyres and weight have a huge bearing on speed. I just think a low power class would prove unworkable with such a diverse range of car specs. But I take the point that some may feel dissolusioned with the ammount of power/£ they would have to find to compete at the front. We need some other way of making it more attractive to those who leave the novice class to feel they can do well as experts BArry makes a good point about most of these 'high power' cars have been steadily evolved over many years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid life crisis Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I am sure Nick and his team who do a sterling job in organising one ofthe best series in the country, are also mindfull of the costs involved in competing :yes: It is sad to see the number of competitors doing a full 10 rounds is sliding in the wrong direction 2010......28 2011......22 2012......21 2013......17 I'm not sure of the exact reason for this, but cost must be a contributing factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveD Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 sign of the times wuv all events are the same not just ss guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XTR2Turbo Posted November 4, 2013 Author Share Posted November 4, 2013 I feel sorry for nick and the speed series committee trying to please everyone top work keep it up guys I hope this topic is not seen as an criticism of Nick or the SSOT as it certainly is not. It's the time of year when things are reviewed and so always good to have a debate. I also don't think anyone is saying it is broken but it would be a shame if costs, particularly in lower classes continued to creep up putting competitors off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenh Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I would also like to add that I am satisfied that within our existing classes, the biggest difference in performance between one competitor and another is nothing to do with engine or gearbox. This season just gone I was consistently faster, sometimes by a big margin, to my times at the same circuits the previous year. And that was despite changing my gearbox from a sequential dogbox to an H-pattern synchromesh box (to qualify for class D), so all things equal I should have been slower not quicker. No, the biggest difference by far is driver ability and experience. If anyone doubts it, just ask Messrs. Everall what happened at Pembury, and how their times compared when for once they drove the same car. Be in no doubt that Barry, and before him Stu and Ade, win the overall championship because of driving ability, not because of their cars. Sure, Barry's car is fantastic, but I bet if he drove my car and I drove his, he'd still whip my A***. So actually, the committee did right in my book by having 2 classes restricted to novice drivers in road-going cars. One thing I would say, if t' committee want to consider changes is maybe flappy paddles and launch control and full throttle gearchanges software (can't remember what it is called at the mo'!) should be restricted to non-road going classes? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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