Controlling costs / expert classes

[Onliest Smeg David]

 

I was just concerned we don't attract new drivers and then loose them as they become experts having completed 20 events.

 

One idea may be to look not just at the number of events entered but the times achieved for novice / expert status  ...

 

But seeing as no one else has picked up this maybe not the issue I thought it might be

 

Ah,   I hadn't picked this up from the thread.

BUT it is something I had thought about and discussed with some other newbies.

 

Some will be 'experts' after 20 events or far less and some will be nowhere near after many many more.

I suspect it will relate more to how many track days a driver is able to do as much as how many sprints.

[pickmaster Andy Lowe]

AH me neither

I've not been paying much attention to points and times and stuff

Just been enjoying the racing

I'll have to have another read of the regs

[Paul Morcom]

I was just concerned we don't attract new drivers and then loose them as they become experts having completed 20 events and feel they need to spend lots extra on their car to compete in the higher class.

 

One idea may be to look not just at the number of events entered but the times achieved for novice / expert status  ...

 

 

As Nick said earlier the organisers welcome ideas to consider but sooner the better as work is about to start on the 2014 regs (well it actually has started).

 

So if anyone has any ideas, no promises can be made as to whether they are adopted or not (it's a complex world) but drop them in an email to Nick and they will be considered.

[windy]

My suggestions - this works for rallying:

 

1. Limit on tyre width and profile for certain classes. This is a good rule because it makes for entertainment -- slippy slidy stuff - and limits the amount of power / torque an engine can sensibly use.
2. Homologated minimum weight requirements. This means that a car cannot be below the manufacturers showroom weight. This also helps to make the older cars, which were always made smaller and lighter, to compete on a more level playing field with the big heavier modern cars. I know Westfields were never homologated - low volume type approved maybe - but presumably Westfield could supply the data for the cars they made in showroom spec. Most of them seem to be around 600+ kg. I am sure some Westfields in the SS road going classes are a lot less than that. The other benefit of this rule is that once the car is all stripped out, the safety equipment (cage, fire extinguishers, shell reinforcing) can be added to bring the car back up to weight. This forces the issue of safety onto the competitor so they make sure the car is robust enough. I know if I ever got back into a Westfield I know I'd want  a full cage on it, knowing that I'd not suffer a weight disadvantage in being safe.  

[Terry Everall]

 

My suggestions - this works for rallying:

 

1. Limit on tyre width and profile for certain classes. This is a good rule because it makes for entertainment -- slippy slidy stuff - and limits the amount of power / torque an engine can sensibly use.
2. Homologated minimum weight requirements. This means that a car cannot be below the manufacturers showroom weight. This also helps to make the older cars, which were always made smaller and lighter, to compete on a more level playing field with the big heavier modern cars. I know Westfields were never homologated - low volume type approved maybe - but presumably Westfield could supply the data for the cars they made in showroom spec. Most of them seem to be around 600+ kg. I am sure some Westfields in the SS road going classes are a lot less than that. The other benefit of this rule is that once the car is all stripped out, the safety equipment (cage, fire extinguishers, shell reinforcing) can be added to bring the car back up to weight. This forces the issue of safety onto the competitor so they make sure the car is robust enough. I know if I ever got back into a Westfield I know I'd want  a full cage on it, knowing that I'd not suffer a weight disadvantage in being safe.  

 

The trouble is we have to comply with ot just our own class rules but those of the organising clubs on the day and so I dont think these ideas will work particularly for classes C,D,E,F,G and H

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

Just so everyone knows the SSOT will be meeting on the sunday morning 10th November after the Speed Series Awards where all points formally put to them. (ie by email to me nick@plays-kool.co.uk) will be considered. 

 

Points raised on this thread will not be considered, unless someone sends them to us.

 

We already have the Novice ruling under consideration, but welcome further suggestions on it.

Things to consider:-

1) we want only genuine novices, not ex rally / race people from a few years ago

2) Once a driver starts to perform well, we need to have a system that moves them to Expert to allow only real novices to compete against each other.

[Barry S]

Don't make too much noise on sunday morning with yah meeting, I'm planning the mother and father of all hang overs

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

Don't make too much noise on sunday morning with yah meeting, I'm planning the mother and father of all hang overs

 

Don;t worry Barry booked the room at the other end of the hotel to you     

 

Hope you booked your misses a seperate room   

[Terry Everall]

I give you a call about 0730hrs Barry if thats ok

You can go for a jog then before breakfast

[Barry S]

Lol do I look like a man who jogs

 

This body was built on pure lazyness, as I always say,,,,,, the good lord invented the internal combustion engine so I don't have to walk / run!!

 

PS Mrs  used to me,,,,, earplugs will be on hand

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

Jog on kitty

[FILFAN]

Got my suggestion off to nick. Don't laugh too much.

[windy]

The trouble is we have to comply with ot just our own class rules but those of the organising clubs on the day and so I dont think these ideas will work particularly for classes C,D,E,F,G and H

Yes agree. Also the introduction of list 1B tyres to the event roadgoing classes is now the main problem. In the days of 1A it was much simpler.

[SteveD]

it is what it is , and what you want to make of it ,but most of all you will enjoy it ,whatever you want to spend or not spend

 

i will be returning to class H next year after a absence of 10 years from running in a westfield class ,having run in j for several years ,i am really looking forward to it and the challenge ,i know two things are gauranteed ,banter and enjoyment

 

there are allways going to be people pushing the envolope /bending rules / etc etc

 

the things that have made me seriously think about coming back into a westfield and the series are that i dont have time anymore to build what i want to (my spaceframe mini) and keep on top of it once built due to me being so busy at work ,

so i thought a westfield would be a good option as the up keep imho would not be as much as the spaceframe mini and also i could build a westy quicker without the stress and fabrication needed

so then it was what class to build a car for ,the only thing i wanted to be on slicks , i could not justify the expense to build/buy a engine needed and then the gearbox on top of that to compete at the level i would like to ,for instance to compete with the new sbd if that goes into h ,as its a no expense spared build by pro's and we all know what it will go like when its done , and imho the only reason that sbd had that chassis made by westfield is so it can be called a westfield so it can enter the ss  , nothing against them, or that as im all for getting the most out of what you have and available to you ,but no one in the ss can compete with that and that put me off and with people buying 5-6k quaife box's on flappy paddle shifters etc etc like i said i cant justify spending that but nothing against the people that have i wish them all the best ,the thing in the back of head with its little voice nagging me (what if the engine goes bang its 10k or whatever)so it got me thinking maybe a rr8  engine and going into the classs with terry but then i know what terry has had done to his engine and set up so that put me off that as i might as well go cec due to costs

so in the end i  decided to go with a busa in H as i could maybe sort of compete and the engine g/box package is available and not at a massive expense ,this appealed to me in the end ,only time will tell if its worth while but i know one thing i will enjoy myself and the banter

 

what ever you choose to drive/spend it does not matter as long as its within the spirit of the speed series and within the rules

 

we have allways been made welcome into the ss in class j and i thank the the powers that be for that ,only once did i hear someone saying what the chuff are we doing letting  none westfields into the ss 

 

the only thing you could maybe even try to control are known standard  engines and bike engines ,that can be sealed at the start of the season but then you have to rely on the honesty of the competitor or have a in house scrutineer to police it ,which is hard work as i have seen what has gone on in the mazda series ,there are allways people who will be cheating gits no matter how hard you try to police it , how they sleep at night is beyond me knowing they are winning by cheating then collecting trophys and standing in front of fellow competitors knowing they are cheating

 

take part and enjoy thats the main thing

[Terry Everall]

Steve

 

I think that a stripped out Busa car will be competetive as I ran mine in H for a few events and it was on the pace despite being fully road legal and weighing 490kgs! I even beat Tommo in the Flymo at Cadwell Park!

I ran crossply slicks (9.2" rears) and the 3.14 sierra diff gave reasonable top speed

Nicks supercharged Busa also went every well in H