tolf Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Sat in london city airport fogbound today. How the hell can fog cripple a plane that costs£3million quid? Radar equipped, very sophisticated electronics, i can see the entire length of the runway- so whats the problem then? ATC can provide a collision avoidence service. bl**dy annoying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zvezdochka Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Visibility threshold includes information on surrounding terrain and buildings specific to each airport, London City has a lot of tall buildings nearby which ATC cannot move. Also may be fog at your destination? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajpearson Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 There are many things that will stop jets flying, the biggest one will be low cloud. Jets can do precision (self) landings but they need to flown manually for the take off. If the Radar Sector height is above the lowest cloud cover (approx 1900ft for London City) then a jet is not meant to go below that without being visual the surface so ensure Collision avoidance. Yes ATC are there for collision avoidance, but only with other traffic. If you go into the rules the pilot remains responsbile for terrain avoidance, therefore pilots are less likely to want to fly in marginal weather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolf Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 Agreed. Amazing that we can send a man to the moon (alledegly) but we cant fly in fog! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 What has one thing to do with the other. If the moon had been foggy they wouldn't have been able to land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Depends on size of plane too - IME nothing smaller than a 737 has the requisite kit to land or take off in fog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 landed in thick fog at night in liverpool once..... couldnt even see the ground with no reference out of the window. the captain just stopped dead on the runway and said he had to wait for someone to come and fetch him as he had no idea where he was on the runway so wouldnt taxi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonclancy Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Depends. IIRC, some pilots use an infra-red landing aid in places like Alaska (sometimes ultra-poor weather and nav equipent / planes not certified for low-vis ops). I found some stuff on synthetic vision HERE As mentioned earlier, different airports and planes will have different take-off minima (some as low as 125 metres, which is a pea-souper by anyone's reckoning!). If you can see the whole runway, then a good bet that departure has been delayed for flow control or for fog at destination (or both). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 A stormy Friday evening in Aberdeen. We were waiting in the tin shed called a waiting lounge for the pilot as we watched two mechanics working on one of the engines. They were dressed in sow-westers and could hardly stand up in the storm force winds. The captain came into the shed, er lounge and announced he was prepared to take off (to Glasgow) if we were. All agreed it was better to fly than spend the weekend in Aberdeen. Best take off I've ever experienced, at one point I'll swear we were flying sideways. All could be seen as the pilot had left the door open and we could see out the windscreen. Great flight, great pilot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Colonial Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 If there's fog, more than one aircraft on the field and human beings are involved, I'd rather be safe than sorry. (I've been to Tenerife North and got the chance to go with an airport worker alongside the runway about ten years ago - there's still the odd small piece of debris on the ground.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FILFAN Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Look what happened to the polish presidential jet when they tried to land in fog. It wasn't a good outcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff101 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I'd rather be a bit late than risk crashing given the choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Eastwood (Gadgetman) - Club Chairman Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yup, if it's the difference between Mr Gadgetman being late, and being the late Mr Gadgetman, I'll stick with a delayed plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolf Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 Just damm annoying that's all. I fly planes and understand about restrictive heights etc, when you cant attend a v important business meeting thats taken months to organise it is a pain in the Anyway, means I dont have to fly home tomorrow, so I can spend time tinkering on the car! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cast iron Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 There are many things that will stop jets flying, the biggest one will be low cloud. Jets can do precision (self) landings but they need to flown manually for the take off. If the Radar Sector height is above the lowest cloud cover (approx 1900ft for London City) then a jet is not meant to go below that without being visual the surface so ensure Collision avoidance. Yes ATC are there for collision avoidance, but only with other traffic. If you go into the rules the pilot remains responsbile for terrain avoidance, therefore pilots are less likely to want to fly in marginal weather So what happens in the dark :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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