Tonsko Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 its our fault things are slipping as we supposedly in charge of this country so ring or petition your local MP only if the masses of upright citizen stand up will any change happen This I can agree with. You might think that you don't have a voice, but enough people together, for long enough will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavinnn Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 This I can agree with. You might think that you don't have a voice, but enough people together, for long enough will. We all know that would never happen though, seeing as the majority of the British population would rather ****** off the system than actually stand up to it. :/ Could literally talk about this all day but it's pointless in some respects. We all think the system is flawed yet we can't think of one that has no faults so we look back to an old option in the hope it will considerably drop crime. Figures show that there is no real gain to bring it back and all it did was kill the odd innocent person. Only real option is to make the current option harder. Eg. Lengthen prison sentences and make people do the full time they were sent down for, and if they ever apply for benefits they instantly get rejected or seriously docked money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveH Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 The risk of executing someone who is actually innocent is unavoidable so the only way we could step forward with the death penalty would be if we were to acknowledge that the greater good would be worth the occasional injustice. Considering the rights of society overall rather than the rights of individuals could transform the severity of punishments at all levels but it would take more backbone than most politicians (or most of the general public come to that) have got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man On The Clapham Omnibus Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 There are two aspects of the debate as far as I am concerned. The moral aspect of carrying out the very act that you are seeking to punish seems perverse - killing as retribution for killing is as crude as many of the barbaric acts that are carried out in more restrictive regimes east of here. I would probably do it myself if one of mine were a victim but that is not the basis for a civilised justice structure. Likewise, whether it is acceptable to take a human life under any circumstances rather than leave it to Divine authority is a personal matter of faith and belief probably best left alone here. The most intractable block to the reintroduction of capital punishment for me is the general incompetence of the judicial system. It cannot be relied upon to guarantee a correct verdict in all cases. I have been a jury member in a Crown Court and never have I seen the old adage that the intelligence of a group is inversely proportional to the number of members made clearer. Whatever instruction the judge gives to the jury, the jurors' personalities render it impossible to reach a 'proper' objective verdict. It may be the best worst system we have, so to speak, but it isn't anywhere near good enough to rely on to decide on the ultimate fate of a person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikpro Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 It would be interesting to see how many previous convictions this man has! I think that we would then see that the criminal justice sytem has let down these two Police Officers as much as it lets down the thousands of honest law abiding citizens it is supposed to take care of each day. Keeping someone in prison costs a large amount of the taxpayers money and hence the arguement that community sentences/re-habilitation are better, however it only costs vasts amounts of money because of the conditions we keep Offenders in. I pesonally beleive in a two teir prison system - for the first 'X' number of times someone offends then every effort should be made to re-habilitate/understand them. (It is worth remembering that by the time someone is sent to prison for the first time they usually have been convicted of a large number of offences). Once they have amassed a certain number of convictions then we just need to realise that these people are just a 'misfit' that can not live in a law abiding community no matter how much effort/money we spend on them and the only way to stop them re-offending is to 'lock them away' for a decent length of time. These prisons should be like the Russian gulags where there are no privaledges, the food is bl**dy awful, disease is rife and death is commonplace - these prisons are run very cheaply! They are not deterants - they don't work for criminals who don't think past the next hour - it is a system designed to keep these Offenders out of society. Looking further back down the chain - the problem in the UK is the Social state; decent families have to think long and hard over having children - it is a huge responsibility and a financial 'burden'. Unfortunately at the lower end of society where the most unsuitable parents belong it has become hugely proffitable to have children that grow up uneducated and with very, if any decent 'role models' to guide them. Having Children should never be a proffit making excercise - if you are long term unemployed then you should get health care vouchers for the child or if you are unsuitable as a parent the child should be taken for adoption. Sod the individuals human rights; we have society as a whole to think of and unless this person has a proper upbringing then they will grow up effecting numerous decent peoples human rights! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Having done jury service myself I can endorse MOTCO's view. I'm not religious, describe my self as agnostic, but I don't believe we have the right to take a life. It is beyond doubt that it does not deter the crime of muredrer so those that call for the return of capital punishment are doing so for the purpose of retribution. I don't think we should get so carried away by this particular terrible crime. It's a one off in the fact that it's the firts time police have been lured to a place to be murdered. It does strike me that there is a BBC programme running at the moment, Good Cop, which started with 2 policeman being lured to a house with the intent of murdering one or both of them. Did this psychopath get the idea from this? I would hope he is imprisoned and never released. Hindly, Brady, Huntley weren't/wont be released. I just can't see any parole board releasing him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 distopia anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Nikpro, he was on Police bail with regard the killing of a man in a pub and then, later (I think it was 2 months) the mans father. This will have to be investigated later as surely someone who is suspected of murder should not be given bail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Dystopia even. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 yes beat me to it.... thought it was spelt wrong but the centrifuge had finished its run and was more pressing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I'll let you off. Only because you play with centrifuges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Algar - Competition Secretary Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 It would be interesting to see how many previous convictions this man has! I think that we would then see that the criminal justice sytem has let down these two Police Officers as much as it lets down the thousands of honest law abiding citizens it is supposed to take care of each day. Keeping someone in prison costs a large amount of the taxpayers money and hence the arguement that community sentences/re-habilitation are better, however it only costs vasts amounts of money because of the conditions we keep Offenders in. I pesonally beleive in a two teir prison system - for the first 'X' number of times someone offends then every effort should be made to re-habilitate/understand them. (It is worth remembering that by the time someone is sent to prison for the first time they usually have been convicted of a large number of offences). Once they have amassed a certain number of convictions then we just need to realise that these people are just a 'misfit' that can not live in a law abiding community no matter how much effort/money we spend on them and the only way to stop them re-offending is to 'lock them away' for a decent length of time. These prisons should be like the Russian gulags where there are no privaledges, the food is bl**dy awful, disease is rife and death is commonplace - these prisons are run very cheaply! They are not deterants - they don't work for criminals who don't think past the next hour - it is a system designed to keep these Offenders out of society. Looking further back down the chain - the problem in the UK is the Social state; decent families have to think long and hard over having children - it is a huge responsibility and a financial 'burden'. Unfortunately at the lower end of society where the most unsuitable parents belong it has become hugely proffitable to have children that grow up uneducated and with very, if any decent 'role models' to guide them. Having Children should never be a proffit making excercise - if you are long term unemployed then you should get health care vouchers for the child or if you are unsuitable as a parent the child should be taken for adoption. Sod the individuals human rights; we have society as a whole to think of and unless this person has a proper upbringing then they will grow up effecting numerous decent peoples human rights! Most sensible suggestion I have seen in a long time. Just wish it would be acted upon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Verona Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 There are different cataegories for prisons. The murderers and rapists are put in Cat A, which are very tough, mainly because of the inmates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User0083 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Not read everything on here, but I do have a very individual view on this and hope that people will join me. Ok so you've got caught, you're gonna do time. You have lost all human rights while you are in prison. Visitors o ce a week for one hour is permitted. Uniforms will be white and daily inspected, if you are not upto standard you get red uniform with little pink hearts. You will be allowed television, you will have a television on in your cell and all communal area's. At 0600 BBC news will begin and at 1030hrs this shall cease and national geographic shall be on ant 1700-2330 BBC news will be back on. That is all the privileges as for as the television goes. You will attend work every other day for 12 hours 0800-2000. As you have no human rights this will be chained together and a chain gang style labour. Cleaning up graffiti, moving rubbish tips around and other worthy jobs. You will be able to volenteer for medical trails and testing, which will be classed as a day at work. There will be a reward system where you shall receive gold stars. gold stars will be removed if negative behaviouris reported. Gold stars will give you such luxuries as an extra pillow, none NHS issue medicated soap for a week. Remember you have lost human rights, do the state owes you nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombanks Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 why dont you just include the waterboarding/bedframes with car batteries and all the other things too. helll oops, i said a naughty word! it all and bring back the rack and judas' cradle. why not go the whole hog and sodd of the judicial system and let the public decide whist brandishing pitch forks and burning torches. you lot are f***** nuts! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.