Speed Series Target Times 2012

[Delboy]

I don't understand how 3 Sisters (2) Class H Target has been declared a soft target when all three drivers in 2011 could not get near the Target set in 2010?

Del

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

As I see it there are 4 classes for below 1800cc (A, C, E and G) and 4 for above 1800cc (B,D,F and H) (without the complication BEC engine sizes)

Are all classes from A to H comparing target times with each other with A being the conceived slowest and H the fastest? I would have thought it would make more sense to compare the classes based on engine sizes as above which is what I thought was going to happen rather than what seems to have happened

[davidgh]

As I see it there are 4 classes for below 1800cc (A, C, E and G) and 4 for above 1800cc (B,D,F and H) (without the complication BEC engine sizes)

Are all classes from A to H comparing target times with each other with A being the conceived slowest and H the fastest? I would have thought it would make more sense to compare the classes based on engine sizes as above which is what I thought was going to happen rather than what seems to have happened

John

What has happened (or should have happened -- this period of consultation is supposed to clear up the issues) is that the smaller engine classes (A,C,E,G) have been compared with each other up the line (thus an E time is considered soft if it was beaten by C or A, but is fine even if it was beaten in D) whilst the larger engine classes (B,D,F,H) have been compared with all preceding letters (so a D time can fail if beaten in A, B or C -- hence Howard at Loton).

HTH

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

Ah OK, thanks for trying to explain - that makes sense but what about Dels query regarding H times at 3 Sisters? is that because a G time has been faster but has mistakenly been included in the calcs?

[Terry Everall]

It should be remebered that not all circuits suit big engined cars etc as in H

Small tracks like Thoresby Park favour the use of a BEC and I should know cos I have taken FTD in both a BEC and CEC in class F and H. Similarly BEC do well at 3 slappers as its a tight Kart track.

[davidgh]

Ah OK, thanks for trying to explain - that makes sense but what about Dels query regarding H times at 3 Sisters? is that because a G time has been faster but has mistakenly been included in the calcs?

John

No recent personal experience of 3-Sis, but it does seem that the Class G TT last year was faster than H -- and as G is a "preceding letter" for H, that would invalidate the H TT.

[Paul Aspden]

Having looked at the target times I can't quite understand why the target time for C has been adopted for E at the Ty Croes events late in the year, when this has not been applied to the earlier meetings such as Curborough, Mira & Pembrey. Should the Ty Croes event not be a STE for class E, as they "should" be faster than class C?

Guess I now need to decide which venues to do, am I going to be able to beet any target times, or should I just go to STE events???

What you doing David!!!

[mark.anson]

Terry

Before you ask the class G TT for Silverstone was originally set by Barney in 2010.

The track layout for 2011 was different as the chicane was further down the straight and therefore made the track faster. As such this would have made the class G time an easy 102 points and therefore it was considered to be a "soft" time.

As Nick has explained we have tried to eliminate as many potential 102 pointers as we can. It is difficult to understand what has been done at first, but the motivation is to make it as fair as we can across all classes and therefore give as many competitors a chance of winning.

Mark

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

Having looked at the target times I can't quite understand why the target time for C has been adopted for E at the Ty Croes events late in the year, when this has not been applied to the earlier meetings such as Curborough, Mira & Pembrey. Should the Ty Croes event not be a STE for class E, as they "should" be faster than class C?

Hi Paul,

I must be reading a different sheet to you as on the sheet on page 1 Class E for Curbrough, Mira & Pembrey are all STE

Have another look

Nick

[davidgh]

Having looked at the target times I can't quite understand why the target time for C has been adopted for E at the Ty Croes events late in the year, when this has not been applied to the earlier meetings such as Curborough, Mira & Pembrey. Should the Ty Croes event not be a STE for class E, as they "should" be faster than class C?

Guess I now need to decide which venues to do, am I going to be able to beet any target times, or should I just go to STE events???

What you doing David!!!

Not my doing, Paul -- I can't work spreadsheets very well so I'm let off that sort of thing.

No times set in C should become TTs for E. A TT for Class E can only be the fastest time previously set at the identical venue in Class E (provided that it's faster than the best set in A or C). I think the second Ty Croes times for E should probably be void.

Looks like a large number of Class E events this year will be "100-pointers", mostly thanks to Mr. Palmer in C. Not as good a measure of the merit of a drive as having a real target time -- but also not a disaster, as I think "102-point" events are going to be thinner on the ground this year.

[Terry Everall]

Mark

I agree and support the need to give everyone a fair chance but we are just trying to understand the logic etc

[V 8]

Mark

I agree and support the need to give everyone a fair chance but we are just trying to understand the logic etc

Good job we're not all your age Tel

[davidgh]

It should be remebered that not all circuits suit big engined cars etc as in H

Small tracks like Thoresby Park favour the use of a BEC and I should know cos I have taken FTD in both a BEC and CEC in class F and H. Similarly BEC do well at 3 slappers as its a tight Kart track.

Terry

The regs don't say that a Class H car has to be large, heavy, and with a big engine. There is every reason to believe that (for instance) Barney could go faster still round Three Sisters or Thoresby if he strapped a supercharger on to his car (which would move him into H). Most Class H competitors have decided that a large car engine gives them the advantage over a BEC at most venues in the Championship. It is not logical, having made that choice, for a Class H competitor to want special treatment at the couple of tracks where the advantage is with a lighter car.

HTH

David

[Terry Everall]

David

The cars are all the same size and the SBD car is not heavy! Both I and Nick Algar both tried BECS in H and went quite well!

The problem is that target times are set at each venue and not overall. Records are in each class on the day so it seems odd to use direct comparisons such as between G and H. At the end of the day I will dive my b*****k* off to beat verybody no matter what car or class but what points I get will be determined by target times

[davidgh]

At the end of the day I will dive my b*****k* off to beat verybody no matter what car or class but what points I get will be determined by target times

Terry

We need no further persuading of that . . . . . . .

. . . . . . . Llandow comes to mind

All best

David