vauxhall ecotec

[brianm]

I'm toying with the idea of using a 2.0 8v or 16v vauxhall engine, but what would be the cheapest way to build one, as  i was planning to run twin 45's

Well thats the real rub, I still stand by the fact that the 8v is a cracking engine, loads of torque, 160 bhp easily obtained,BUT, for a few dollars more, the 16V offers an easy 185 ish, and the conversion cost is just about the same, ie you need all the same ancilliaries which ever way you go.

Brian.

[stu999]

My mate finshed a Westie with the 8v VX engine in it last year. A real torquey engine, and a joy to drive. TBH though, you have the same, if not more hassle to put an 8v engine in a Westie, and engine aside, will probably cost you more too. At least with the 16v option, you can pick up stuff like exhaust manifolds, inlet/carbs etc for the 16v secondhand off this board etc as people upgrade, whereas 8v stuff is as rare as rocking horse spit, and chances are that for an exhaust manifold you would have to have one custom made.

P.s. dont worry about dodgy cylinder heads, most of them have been repaired successfully by now....  

[wookie]

so the ignition is simple then..........as its my first kit....and any clues on what type of dissy i'd need from the 8V, the only other problem is that its not been sva'd and is the single donor vehicle (sierra donor), the way around it i thought of going was to just change the engine number in the existing V5

[stu999]

You need any dizzy from an 8v VX, with a stand alone electronic ignition system (IIRC off an 1800 Mk2 Astra SRi etc). As I mentioned before, there are two different types of dizzy drive, a 'slot' type and pin type. It's the pin type you need, you will know its right if it matches the dizzy drive on the 16v. P.s. the 16v dizzy wont work as it doesnt have any adjustment or advance mechanism. You may find the ignition leads wont quite be long enough. I found some off a 16v Mazda engine that did the trick just fine. You even have an output off the ampifier for a rev counter (green wire IIRC).

HTH Stu.

[slippy]

Old thread but update

Interesting read mate

Wind back to the March’96 issue of CCC, and you will recall that we were getting pretty excited about the tuning potential of the new Vauxhall 1600, 16-valve Ecotec engine. Just by fitting his tapered throttle body fuel injection system, Steve has seen a solid 164 bhp from an otherwise stock engine. That’s seriously impressive. What’s so good about the 1600 Ecotec? Well lets recap briefly. Unlike the 1800 and 2-litre Ecotec 16-valvers, the 1600 engine features a power friendly cylinder head. In fact, according to Steve, it is quite obvious that the 1600 Ecotec was designed to be the smaller power producing brother to the legendary 150 bhp 2-litre Vauxhall unit. The head is reputed to have been designed by Cosworth, and doesn’t feature the emissions trickery of the other engines. It is thought that the 1600 Ecotec was designed with power in mind. In fact the only thing that Vauxhall has done to keep the power down is fit very mild cams. The evidence is plain to see. Take the valve sizes: 31mm inlet valves and 27.4mm exhaust valves compared to the original Vauxhall engine of 33mm and 29mm respectively. Doing some quick calculations, this means the 1600 has 88% of the 2-litre’s inlet valve area from just 80% of its capacity. This effectively means that the 1600 runs larger valves than the excellent power-producing 2-litre engine. And it gets better. The 1600 valves have a 6mm stem while the 2-litre runs 7mm, so the effective area is better on the smaller engine. Things are just as good on the exhaust front. The 1600 engine has 89% of the 2-litre’s valve area - even better than the inlets. As a percentage of inlet-to-exhaust ratio - another good sign for tuning potential. The two engines also use identical cam followers. Given that the standard engine gives such excellent power, Steve reckoned that 175-180 bhp would be a mere formality with some tweaky cams. And that was the next phase of the project that we were expecting to cover. However, this has been put on ice (Steve has developed a 180 bhp spec, but we’re concentrating on bigger and better things here) since Steve was given the opportunity to fully develop the engine with a serious cash injection from, of all places, Russia? Starting from scratch, Steve had just eight weeks to develop an ultimate spec 1600 Ecotec engine. Given the engine’s similarities to the 2-litre unit, Steve decided to go for a scaled-down version of the 270 bhp engine that resides in his Westfield, bar a few changes. Down at the bottom end only the standard crank remains, since a Doug Kiddey crank couldn’t be manufactured in time. This turns Arrow rods and lightweight Omega Race pistons. At the top end the head is virtually standard aside from basic stuff like matching up the ports and wasted valves. An all new SBD cam profile has been adopted for the 1600 engine. Steve describes this as a bit of a concept cam in that is was a bit hit and miss as to whether it was going to work. But work it most certainly does. Fuelling is naturally by Steve’s highly successful tapered throttle body injection set up with engine management via an MBE black box. Power? Well you’re dying to know are you not? Well given that this is the beginning of the development programme, 202 bhp is pretty stunning we’re sure you will agree. A good 220 bhp must surely be on the agenda with a steel crank, bigger valves and peakier cams. A Corsa with 200+bhp would be a pretty potent device but what about a Westfield or a Caterham? As soon as someone starts running one of these engines in, say, an up to 1700cc class in sprints and hillclimbs, whether it be in 164, 180 or 202 bhp form, then it’s bye bye Crossflow, Zetec or even K-Series. Even an all steel Crossflow would be struggling against any of these specs and the Zetec and K-Series don’t really have the cylinder head potential to produce this sort of power, not from 1600cc’s anyway. And there are plenty of these engines around too. A mere £400/£500 should get you a good low mileage donor engine

[Hammy]

£2500-£3000 - falls off perch...

For igniton, if using carburettors Megajolt has to be the obvious answer - thats what I'm using on my XE project (£200?) -some pics on my facebook. Can't see why anyone would entertain a dizzy by choice in a setup without vac advance for road use.

I know you guys love to spend lots on money on your cars , but..

Its worth pointing out that 160-170 Bhp is perfectly possible from a standard engine taken straight from the scrappy without even taking the cam cover off-  and would cost about £250.  Rebuilding it and then modifying to get 200Bhp will up the cost dramatically ( £2000 for 30bhp?) - Is it worth it for a road car for you, especially  if you are on a tight budget?

Mondeo motors are far more common and cheap and fit type 9's without a bellhousing adapter saving £160.   There are people in the club with 150,000 milers taken from the scappy that produce good power on carbs for very little cost ( it will probalby only have 160,000  on it in ten years time!). They also come with most of the ignition parts you need bult in and ready to go for a MJ setup. I have a "tiger" friend who paid £100 for a whole 2.0 car,  drove it for a week , was happy with the engine, scrapped the rest of the car.. Engine has now ran for 2yrs, burns no oil, and gives 160BHP on 45's.

[stu999]

For igniton, if using carburettors Megajolt has to be the obvious answer - thats what I'm using on my XE project (£200?) -some pics on my facebook. Can't see why anyone would entertain a dizzy by choice in a setup without vac advance for road use.

...because this thread originally ran in 2003. The 'Mega' thing is still a bit of an unknown quantity - then it was all but unheard of.

Even now, I would personally struggle to go to the  hassle of an generally unsupported ECU, when, by careful shopping, MBE 956's etc can be bought for similar money.

And I could have a converted dizzy motor running in next to no time. Sure, a well mapped 3D system is going to be *far* better to drive, but for simplicity and mucho cheapness...

Note: the dizzy thing may not work in the 1600 16v

[brianm]

Seems like a life on Mars thread

[Hammy]

...because this thread originally ran in 2003.

Life on Mars indeed  never notice the origional date!!

-weren't all the engines side valve in those days anyway?