KerryS Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Injectors, like I had on the Westy's Zetec, are typically around the £60-70 mark. My daughter has had to have a new one in her VW T5 Transporter and it was around £200 mark. Why the massive difference? Is it because the diesel injector is a direct and has to work into high pressure whereas the one for my Zetec engine works into more or less atmospheric pressure? Quote
Major Stare Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Because it VW stamped on it. SWMBO friend has a new shape VW Beetle that cost £70 for a new head lamp bulb Quote
MGF255 Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 vw or not , modern diesel injectors are a very different beast to a standard petrol injector , your vw probably uses individual unit injectors which not only inject diesel but also generate the high fuel pressure needed for good power and low emmisions . In general they are very reliable but can be destroyed if the incorrect grade of engine oil is used . Quote
Matt Seabrook Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Modern Diesel injectors work on much higher pressure and inject much faster than petrol injectors. On common rail the diesel injector can run at more than 21,000 psi and they typically cost £250 for reconditioned injectors. Not sure about the cost of the VW pricing but does not sound out the way Quote
JeffC Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Injectors, like I had on the Westy's Zetec, are typically around the £60-70 mark. My daughter has had to have a new one in her VW T5 Transporter and it was around £200 mark. Why the massive difference? Is it because the diesel injector is a direct and has to work into high pressure whereas the one for my Zetec engine works into more or less atmospheric pressure? try a 170bhp vag £500 each and they normally need 4 after 60k Quote
pistonbroke Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Can you not get them serviced ? you could with my Perkins 4108 Quote
Martin Keene Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 You can get the refurbed. That typically cost £200, which is what I think Kerry's daughter has got. New ones are £500. The reason they are so expensive is because of the pressure. A petrol injector sees max 5 bar (70 psi) and are made from injection moulded plastic. A common rail diesel injector will see up to 2000 bar (28,000 psi. Yes twenty eight thousdand psi) and thus have to be machined from steel etc to withstand the pressure. The tolerances inside the injector are frankly non exsistant, we even assemble the injectors, fuel pump and HP pipes to the engine in a clean room at work. Injector assembly itself is done in something akin to an operating theatre... Quote
Matt Seabrook Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Martin which manufactures are using up to 2000 bar? We have not seen any much over 1550b yet and Peugeot and Citreon run at about 1350b max from the ones we get through the workshop. It never ceases to amaze me the pressures required for a cleaner burn. Quote
Martin Keene Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Most manufacturers are playing with 2000bar now, Bosch, Delphi and Denso. Not in common circulation yet, but they will be more and more around with Euro 6 on the way. I know Bosch have started playing around with 2200-230 for future emission regulations. We have just gone to 2000 bar at work. Quote
Matt Seabrook Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Euro 6 is causing some problems with diesels and I can see an end to diesels in the next ten years or less the way things are going. Direct injected petrol engines are taking over from diesels and are likely to be the next big thing. Quote
KerryS Posted March 21, 2011 Author Posted March 21, 2011 Thank- you for the explanation, chaps. Quote
jeff oakley Posted March 22, 2011 Posted March 22, 2011 Euro 6 is causing some problems with diesels and I can see an end to diesels in the next ten years or less the way things are going. Direct injected petrol engines are taking over from diesels and are likely to be the next big thing. You are correct Matt, many manufacturers are already openly talking about the emmissions for euro six being very hard to acheive and more importantly reliably keep them there. It is predicted that smaller forced induction petrol engines will be a big part of the future. In particular for the smaller commuter car. If you have a diesel it is a very good idea to keep running an injector cleaner through on a regular basis. Quality ones from Forte or Wynns do help to keep everything lubricated and clean. Also regular servicing of the fuel filters and correct oil spec at all times. Quote
Martin Keene Posted March 22, 2011 Posted March 22, 2011 Jeff's on the money there. The ever tightening legislation is relentless. I don't know how Euro 6 and Tier 4 Interim (the latest off highway regs) compare but a lot of manufactures are now running DEF to meet them. DEF became commonplace on trucks at Euro 5. So I guess Euro 5 is similar to Tier 4 Interim and Euro 6 is similar to Tier 4 Final. Euro 7 or Tier 5 if, when?, they arrive will be a world class nightmare. Quote
Ian Podmore Posted March 22, 2011 Posted March 22, 2011 The ever tightening legislation is relentless. I don't know how Euro 6 and Tier 4 Interim (the latest off highway regs) compare but a lot of manufactures are now running DEF to meet them. DEF became commonplace on trucks at Euro 5. So I guess Euro 5 is similar to Tier 4 Interim and Euro 6 is similar to Tier 4 Final. What's DEF? I know what DPF is (was a right pain on my 170bhp PD VW engine, less so on replacement 1.6 one), but never heard of DEF. The cost of things like injectors makes me wonder if the balance has tipped too far toward diesel engined cars over the last few years. Unless you are doing the miles, perhaps an efficient petrol engine is a better bet now? We had to contribute to 4 replacement injectors on a Toyota 2.2 diesel a few years ago that was just outside warranty. Dealer wouldn't change just the faulty injectors either. That was thick end of £1,500 IIRC. Was mighty impressed by a 1.2 turbo in a loan car a few months back, and look at the power / economy figures for the Ford 1.6 Turbo. Getting very diesel like. Quote
Martin Keene Posted March 22, 2011 Posted March 22, 2011 Err, sorry, work mode there... DEF = Diesel Exhaust Fluid = Ad Blue = Urea It is the commercial version of the sheep p**s injected into the exhaust stream they were joking about on Top Gear years ago. Quote
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