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RAC Roll bar harness idea....


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Posted

Ok, so my car appears to have been built without the harness mounts in the chassis (typical!;)..... me being me I would rather do without the hassel of having these welded in and I thought maybe I could have a lower bar attached to the RAC bar and have the harnesses coming off of that?

cue my dodgy mock up..........

harness_bar.jpg

What do you think?  would this be permissable on tracks etc?  The bar would be clamped and locked to the RAC bar in order to remove the harnesses etc.  im sure I have seen this kind of thing used before?

Let me have your thoughts!

Paul

Posted

Some questions :

- How would you prevent the shoulder straps moving from side to side ?  Might need to look at what they do with the Elise harness bar

- How would you attach the shoulder straps to the bar ?  Stitched loops with the bar threaded through ?

- Would the shoulder straps end up higher than your shoulders ?  Not entirely sure that's a good idea because, even with a crotch strap, you might rise up under the shoulder straps in an impact or inversion.

- How would the harness bar be attached to the RAC bar ?  I'm pretty sure you can't drill holes through the RAC bar, or at least it's probably not a good idea.

- How would you ensure the harness bar is the right length and cannot move ?

I'm not deliberately trying to p*** on your chips but where safety is concerned there is, IMO, zero margin for compromise or **** ups !

Posted

I would have thought that you could weld on fittings to the roll bar which would be much easier.  (roll bar could be removed, no welding near your fuel tank no electrics to disconnect)

Or it would be easier to take the roll bar off to have a professional welder put on the attachements.  It can be done as I have seen one westfield with this arrangement.  

Best to check the SVA regs prior to modification as that bit of the regs is worthwhile and in your best interests to comply with (even if your car is now registered).

Posted

Friend of mine (ex-Westfield owner) is building a Luego Viento except it has a CVH instead of a V8  ???  and this car has the shoulder harness attachment points located on the underside of the lower cross bar exactly as in your illustration - as this is a 'production' model I think it must be OK for the SVA.

I guess you would need to remove the rollover bar and get someone to drill holes and insert the correct lugs into the bar and weld them up carefully - before you even think it please DON'T just drill a hole and put the bolt straight through the bar it won't be safe! :(

Posted
How would you prevent the shoulder straps moving from side to side ?  Might need to look at what they do with the Elise harness bar

Well, ive not seen the Elise harness bar so I cant comment on that.  With regard to the straps moving, I would have thought one tightened around a person they wouldnt go anywhere?

How would you attach the shoulder straps to the bar ?  Stitched loops with the bar threaded through ?

I was thinking stitched loops but the previous question has raised some doubts.  I could possibly mount the harness hoops on the underside of the harness bar, this would put them at roughly the same level as where the original mountings would be, but obviously upside down.....

How would the harness bar be attached to the RAC bar ?  I'm pretty sure you can't drill holes through the RAC bar, or at least it's probably not a good idea.

I was planning on having mounts welded to the RAC bar with the harness bar being bolted/locked in place.

How would you ensure the harness bar is the right length and cannot move ?

I doubt welded mounts would move, carefull measurement would see the bar at the correct length..... ie: not measured by me :D

All very valid questions, thanks for the obvious thought involved.

Or it would be easier to take the roll bar off to have a professional welder put on the attachements

Bingo!

It can be done as I have seen one westfield with this arrangement.

Ohhh, dont spose you have any pics / further information?

I will check with SVA/Westfield today.  A friend has raised some concerns as to if the bar were to fail in an impact, it would 'break my neck'.... Am in right in assuming a welded bar to the RAC bar (bolted to the chassis) will be as strong as mounts set into the original chassis member?

Cheers

Paul

Posted

just spoken to the factory, they raise a couple of things I hadnt thought of, one of those points being the original mounts for the 3 point are going to the in the way of the car.... chopping bits out the chassis aint a good idea!

So Im gonna have to bite the bullet and have a new set of mounts welded into the chassis.

Does anyone have some pics I can look at to get an idea of exactly where they need to go?

I also need pics of the mounts for the rear stays for the RAC bar :(

Cheers

Paul

Posted

The harness mounts are a short length of approx 19mm steel with a 7/16" UNF thread through it.

The rear rollbar mounts look like the front wishbone mounts and are next to the petrol tank. I would be surprised if you didn't have them.

Posted
I would be surprised if you didn't have them

YOU would be suprised!?  I almost fell over ;):D

Posted

This is the best picture I have at the moment

Roll%20cage%2005.jpg

Paul

Posted

POC

Sorry chap you ain't gonna like this  :(  :(  But it just ain't worth the risk / compromise - its your safety that's in question  :(  :(

Get the proper mounts and fixings welded into place in the correct position as designed by Westfield - Maybe let them undertake all works necessary and minimise any liability issues to ensure full warranty - in the event of a claim  ;)  ;) Which hopefully you won't need........... but are you prepared to risk it  ;)

Posted
Get the proper mounts and fixings welded into place in the correct position as designed by Westfield - Maybe let them undertake all works necessary and minimise any liability issues to ensure full warranty - in the event of a claim     Which hopefully you won't need........... but are you prepared to risk it

Yeah thanks Mark, I decided earlier this morning that im going the standard route, most of the time its ok to be different (read as Lazy) but not with saftey, mounts have been ordered from the factory and will be with me soon.  

You can just about see the rear rollbar stay mount in this picture and again in this one.

The harness mounts are in this pic.

Thanks Bob, exactly what I was looking for!  Any chance you could pull out a tape measure and let me know exactly where these little b*******s need to be welded?

Paul - I did call but you had popped out, you have PM :)

Thanks everyone!

Paul

Posted

Do i need holes in the seats to put the harnesses through?

(please say no cos im gonna cry)

Posted

4 points = preferably yes

A must for 3 points  :(  :)  :)

I've only ever seen em once though - on Westfield high back sports seats - purple car sometimes seen around Stourbridge, unless he's been nicked again for speeding  :devil:  :devil:  :devil:  :D  :D  :devil:  I digress, couldn't help it  :devil:  :D

Westfields trim dept fitted two slots into the back of his seats for 4 point harnesses - not too difficult a job - most folks seem to "wrap" em around the side  ;)  But perhaps doesn't give a proper fit  ???

Posted

definately do what I think you have settled on - ie do it properly.

The lugs for the roll bar and the threaded seatbelt bobbins will cost less than a tenner.

you ought to be able to find a local engineering company who can get a coded welder to weld them in for you, then patch up the powdercoat with some good paint.

you might also want to consider welding some stifners in behind the mounts down to the diff area.

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