HANS Device

[Tonto1]

Is anyone using one in their Westfield and did you need to make any changes to the seat belt mounting points or the seats themselves??

As always any thots or advice much appreciated!

[Nick Algar - Competition Secretary]

Not in a Westie, but have used then in both single seaters. Schroth do a guide on how to fit them, do a google to find their website and have a look at it, should cover most things.

[Richard M Green]

I'm using HANS in a car (1999 SEW) with Willans 6 point harness (with 3" shoulder straps).  The car has factory fitted fixings and a Playskool seat.

Installation iaw FIA guide here: click

I was asking the MSA representatives at the show last week when they will make HANS mandatory for club motorsport - the short answer is "not soon" - it seems that they recognise the reluctance of those who who are perfectly willing to spend money on go faster modifications, but have little concern for their personal safety.....

[Arm]

QUOTE

I was asking the MSA representatives at the show last week when they will make HANS mandatory for club motorsport - the short answer is "not soon" - it seems that they recognise the reluctance of those who who are perfectly willing to spend money on go faster modifications, but have little concern for their personal safety.....

Were you representing the views of 'club motorsport' ?

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

Echo Arm's statement.

I have a plumbed in extinguisher. I should have asked when everyone will have to have one  

[Richard M Green]

Arm: I wasn't offering any view; I simply asked the question. By "club motorsport" I deliberately wasn't limiting the scope of the discussion only to racing.

John: Actually "Arms statement" was Arm's question. Now answered.

A plumbed in extinguisher adds approximately 2% to the weight of the car and is therefore directly detrimental to performance. The HANS is at least an order of magnitude lighter and therefore has minimal performance impact. I am therefore supremely indifferent to whether anyone else chooses to wear one.

Perhaps you can think up a more appropriate analogy....?

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

OK - I echo his "question".    It's now answered

A suitably placed weighty object can help in the corner weighting department and can therefore be directly detrimental to performance

[Richard M Green]

...and a suitably placed apostrophe (or two) can help in the legibility  department.

[Matt Seabrook]

...and a suitably placed apostrophe (or two) can help in the legibility  department.

As for safety yes I can see the value of a HANS device a full cage a six point harness a plumbed in extinguisher three layer Nomex suit Nomex under crackers boots, gloves, helmet, arm restraints etc.etc. but where do you stop. A friend struggles to compete in a bog standard Westfield and has said that having to replace his skid lid this year is likely to mean he is out of sprinting. Do we want to make this a sport for the elite and well healed as I consider my self very lucky now to be able to take part?

[Richard M Green]

The point the MSA were making was that some competitors might think nothing of spending £500 on a set of tyres, but would baulk at spending the same amount on a crash helmet or a HANS device.

I would venture to suggest that the answer to “where do you stop?” can only be a personal judgement based on one’s own personal circumstances.

That judgement should not, in my opinion, be based on pride or peer pressure.

When I drove at Wiscombe last year I was well aware of some of the none too subtle derogatory remarks made in the paddock about the fact that I wore a HANS device.

I couldn’t be bothered to justify myself to those people by explaining that a friend of mine suffered a severe brain injury two seasons ago as a consequence of a hillclimb accident in which he was otherwise physically unharmed. One can only speculate about whether a HANS device would have made a difference.

At the end of the day, the accelerator works both ways, and only the person pressing it can decide what constitutes an acceptable risk……

[Matt Seabrook]

Yes I agree self regulation to a point is a good thing but I get the impression that you would like to see the MSA introduce a HANS system which is not then self regulation. The other point is could a poorly fitted system be more of a hazard than no system at all. To be honest Richard I thought long and hard about fitting a HANS system my self this year as I had to buy a new lid to meet the regulations for 2010 and decided against it. I thought about just buying a lid with HANS posts fitted and didn't in the end. I have made my choice and hope I have done the right thing. I did not feel the need for HANS. I can see a problem in road going as some cars only have inertia real seatbelts fitted so to get a HANS fitted its going to be a six/five point harness a new seat  a new lid and HANS all of which could add up to well over a grand and in a climate like we have its not just my mate that could be put off.

[Richard M Green]

Matt, it was not my intention either during last week's discussion, or in my posts in this thread, to suggest that the MSA should mandate the use of HANS - and certainly not for hillclimbing and sprinting in road going vehicles, many of which as you rightly say would require considerable re-work.

That said I'm surprised that the MSA hasn't yet pushed for more widespread use of HANS in circuit racing.

[davidgh]

FWIW, Guy seems to think that 750MC will go that way.

[Matt Seabrook]

Matt, it was not my intention either during last week's discussion, or in my posts in this thread, to suggest that the MSA should mandate the use of HANS - and certainly not for hillclimbing and sprinting in road going vehicles, many of which as you rightly say would require considerable re-work.

That said I'm surprised that the MSA hasn't yet pushed for more widespread use of HANS in circuit racing.

Fair comment Richard circuit racing may be different as speeds reached are likely to be higher than hills and sprints for more of the time and its not just you that could cause a problem. This is one of the reasons I have stayed away for circuits as I just could not afford to do it.  

[Tonto1]

To be honest I am all for them from a safety aspect as in any form of motorsport wether it hills or circuits then there is a chance (hopefully very very small) that you could do yourself serious injury.  And in such an instance the cost of these things could be re-paid to you thousand-fold.

My current problem though is that the cheapest device will set you back at least 450quid, which for what is basically nothing more that some formed plastic (or Carbon on the more expensive versions) and padding, it's absolutely and utterly horrendous.  It costs nearly 100quid to buy to a pair of alloy fixings!  Can't help but feel ripped off and the victim of severe profitering when it comes to the price of this stuff!!