Credit Crunch and Alternative energy Speed Series

[woodman]

Steve . Although i also like the idea of an 8v class i have to agree with Nick about the policing of such a class

An 8v class would only be relavant to the SS so would it make you want to do more events?

Do you and Richard (and anyone else with similar cars) feel that because you cant win on the day that it is not worth you entering events?

I would prefer the number of qualifying events to be dropped to 8 as Mark suggested

[greenandmean]

Stuart more posts this last couple of days than the previous couple of years, time on your hands/  

This is starting to look like a x-flow convention.  

[woodman]

Hello Paul

Well i'm not exactly rushed off my feet at work.

Whats your opinion on Richards proposals?

[Mark Stanton]

Paul was gonna take Richard down the pub                

[greenandmean]

Steve . Although i also like the idea of an 8v class i have to agree with Nick about the policing of such a class

An 8v class would only be relavant to the SS so would it make you want to do more events?

I agree with your earlier comments, nice idea but the practicalities and extra administration I'm not so sure of, or indeed how well it would be supported while there are a few of us still running x-flow/ cvh how often do you get a bunch of us at the same meeting.

Also lets not forget that pinto's are 8 valve, so we now have 2ltr competing against 1600/1700cc.

Perhaps its time for an 8 valve award  annually at the awards do and not just discretionally?

Finally its nice to run an OLD 8 valver and kick the   of newer more powerful motors.

[greenandmean]

Paul was gonna take Richard down the pub                

Couldn't get him off his keyboard  

[davidgh]

[bore Mode]

Unfortunately, as has been pointed out with reference to the "Locost" series, frequently the more strict the rule set the higher the cost of providing the small technical advantage still needed to be consistently up front. Restrictive rule sets can always be overcome (to an extent) by application of, to use Tel's expression, boatloads of money.

MSA event class pots *can* be over-rated. As an example, I got one at Pembrey in 2007 for beating Tim Pennington (Pembrey is a power circuit) by 0.01s, whilst suspecting strongly that I had 10-15% more horses than he sitting in a chassis at least as good as his. It was great competition on the day, but do you think I felt I really deserved the pot? In truth, I was out-driven by someone I respect. Try reading Maslow (start here)  --  you might decide that close competition with good mates on the day is worth more than class trinkets.

[/bore Mode]

[machin]

Nick,

     I agree with what you've said and I understand the problem of policing it..... you're right I can see that someone might try and cheat but in reality is policing this set of rules any different from policing a ruling which is based on an area of the car which is completely hidden from view?  

There was a case in a recent-ish Isle of Man TT event where a competitor was disqualified when it was found on random strip-down testing that his engine was over capacity....  Now what I'm not suggesting is that anyone is cheating before anyone accuses me of that!  What I'm suggesting is that actually the speed series is pretty much self policing, and that's in an area where, lets face it, you could quite easily cheat.....  Take my case for example, I've just bought a 1640cc xflow.... but does anyone know I haven't stripped it and bored it right out?  Not at all......

Basing a "standard" class on maximum inlet sizes are a black and white limitation... you either have 32mm chokes or 47mm plenum butterfly  (etc) or not.... we're not asking people to declare a horse power figure... or get it verified with a rolling road plot (and who'd believe it anyway?).... surely SBD (or someone similar) could quite easily come up with a range of inlet specs which are about equal? I've suggested some from a readily available motoring book in my first post... but getting one of the speed series sponsors to rubber stamp something would be much better.

And I'm not thinking that by having a <150bhp class I'm going to turn up and win.... far from it..... I've been at plenty of events to know that there's people out there with very similar machines who are way quicker than I....

I'm also not suggesting that people with exotic machines should be turned away.... I love seeing these extreme machines too, and it would be crazy to limit these guys out of the game and make everyone drive around in cars with engines of a 50 year old design!!!

The suggestion that has evolved over these pages (i.e. times amalgamated with the existing classes before awarding points) means that there is essentially no change to the speed series as it currently is.... the cars are still grouped in categories divided by displacement, and the really quick people will still shine through on the national scene.... all it does is give those people who don't want to upgrade their cars something to compete for....

I also think it would be a really positive thing for the WSCC too.... imagine if the latest article on sprinting in the magazine said something like "There's even a class for less highly tuned cars, so you can run your road car against similar machinery without having to resort to engine upgrades or stripping your car down to the bear bones" That might get more people out.... I think it would also present the WSCC SS in a great light outside of its existing members as a club sport which caters for all.... from the tame road-car (whether a reasonably tuned 8v engine or a modern, but not highly tuned, 16v), right up to the fire-breathing slick shod monsters.... with awards for all....

I'm going to try not to post on this subject again as I know its not doing me any favours.... I would just ask that everyone thinks about it over the current season and asks themselves "Actually, is it really that dificult to achieve, and does it really do any harm if the guys at the middle to back of the pack (Stu, Tim, Paul etc excepting!) have something to fight over?"

On the subject of admin.... I really am happy to take on a role for this year if there's a need for data entry or something similar.... I have spent my time in the Parcel Force computer room, so I can type in numbers much faster than I can drive!!!!    

[Mark Stanton]

Think you got something totally wrong there Mr H          

You should replace [bore mode] with perhaps [common snse/ mode]  or [sS good sport/mode]        

[Scottish Bloke]

Just a thought, can we have a class just for blue cars?

Sorry, bye.

[woodman]

Well i think Andy R was in a class of his own last year so perhaps if there was a blue class the rest of us would stand a better chance

[Scottish Bloke]

Well i think Andy R was in a class of his own last year so perhaps if there was a blue class the rest of us would stand a better chance

****ter    

[Mark Stanton]

Richard

Just a suggestion and not meant to be patronising in any manner - concentrate on your season, your personal driver development and achievement, the optimum set-up of you car to squeeze every last tenth of a second, some luck that you will be able to compete at a minumum of 12 events scoring as many points as you can - hopefully attend the Awards

and then if you can come back and tell everyone that:

1. You've not enjoyed a full season of SS

2. You've not had something to fight for

3. You've not won an award for all you efforts.

If you have some luck (without engines going bang), get the events in and then tell me you've not achieved any one of the three above - I'll pay for your drinks at the awards do      

If you answer yes - then you buy my drinks    

Thanks for your offer of admin - fret not however you're not the only one that can handle spreadsheets          

[machin]

Mark, I agree with everything you said.... and I will try and attend the awards do next time.... I can guarantee I'll be buying you a drink... I've enjoyed all previous years, and everyone has been really nice and friendly...

which is the main reason I didn't bother with the HSA series last year and was going to more rounds of the WSCC until the engine went pop!

I'm not sure on 12 events tho!.... but definitely 8 are on the cards.... the new G/F already thinks I spend too much time on cars and the season hasn't started yet!      

[Mark Stanton]

8 might not be enough for overall but you could be in the frame     take your G/F away on a few social weekends