F1 Race

[Captain Colonial]

I was in Prague over the weekend and saw the race. I really think Lewis and McLaren have been shafted over this, but what was interesting was the news on the telly later.  The French and Czech TV reports showed the initial LH chicane overshoot when reporting the penalty, but no video on LH dropping back and then KR swerving all over the place, and LH's great pass.

Yep, there's a bias going on.  And unless the penalty is reversed, I refuse to WASTE MY TIME watching another F1 race.

/Not a McLaren, LH, or anybody else supporter - just a racing supporter

[tex]

i find the name the ferrari fans give lewis funny -

'ramilton'

[Richgm]

like uncle Max?

In light of tabloid stories about uncle Max earlier this year and his ability to hold his hands up, say his done it, sue the said tabloid and win. :-

"NO COMMENT"  

[Norman Verona]

Well I am biased. I would like to see a Brit win.

However that doesn't mean I want to see him win unfairly.

having read all the above and looked at the videos I come to the conclusion that he probably did commit an offence. I also assume (as I don't watch these boring drives around a circuit) that many other drivers were guilty of the same offence.

On balance and as as the person he is accused of gaining an advantage over didn't finish so wasn't disadvanteged and the accusation is borderline anyway, that no penalty was due.

As long as enough fuss is made the authorities will think twice about imposing more borderline decisions against LH for the rest of the season.

[cast iron]

[Blatman]

QUOTE

The statement was released in respect of Hamilton's offence and not Kimi's. Just because Kimi did something wrong later doesn't mean it needs to be raised when dealing with Hamilton.

Oh, OK. Two wrongs make a right when it goes your way, but not in any other circumstance? Do me a favour...

[FW500]

Not at all, but it's extra information that's not relevant to Hamilton's offence.

The rules concerned are very clear indeed - the application of the penalties is where it all falls down.

Article 30.3 (a) of the 2008 Formula One Sporting Regulations :

During practice and the race, drivers may use only the track and must at all times observe the provisions of the Code relating to driving behaviour on circuits

So the rule itself is clear and Hamilton did break it there can be no dispute - what is woolly is how the incident can be dealt with:

Article 16.2 (a) of the 2008 Formula One Sporting Regulations :

It shall be at the discretion of the stewards to decide, upon a report or a request by the race director, if a driver or drivers involved in an incident shall be penalised

so as I said before, the stewards are allowed to pick and choose which incidents they wish to penalise. then when they do decide to penalise:

Article 16.3 of the 2008 Formula One Sporting Regulations :

The stewards may impose any one of three penalties on any driver involved in an Incident :

a) A drive-through penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane and re-join the race without stopping ;

b) A ten second time penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane, stop at his pit for at least ten seconds and then re-join the race.

c) a drop of ten grid positions at the driver’s next Event.

However, should either of the penalties under a) and b) above be imposed during the last five laps, or after the end of a race, Article 16.4b) below will not apply and 25 seconds will be added to the elapsed race time of the driver concerned.

Even the penalty is fairly clear - the element that causes all the problems is the 'applying the penalty at the stewards discretion' bit.

[Norman Verona]

Can someone explain what this is about. As I understand it:

1) there is a rule that says you must not take an advantage over another competitor unfairly

2) ther's another rule that says you must not leave the track

These two rules are not linked. So Hamilton has been penalised because he left the circuit NOT because by so doing he gained an advantage.

If that's correct how many other drivers left the circuit (genuine question as I never saw the race)

More importantly did the drivers who were 2nd and 3rd and were moved up leave the circuit?

Also if it's an offence to leave the circuit shouldn't the run off areas be closed and barriered. Otherwise the race organisers are aiding and abetting the drivers to commit an offence.

A high court judge would have a field day with this (assuming my understanding is correct)

The online petition is now over 22,000. But that's a fraction of a per-centage of the viewers around the world so no ones going to take too much notice.

[Blatman]

The relevancy is that all offences should be punished equally and without prejudice. The FIA or their appointed stewards are just not applying the rules fairly and equitably. Simple as that.

[FW500]

No arguement from me there.

I would say that just because a copper might let one guy off for driving at 46mph in a 40 zone doesn't make it legal. But I wholeheartedly agree that the problem with F1 is the consistency with application of the rules. Fair or unfair LH did break the rule and he's been shown the gallows for it.

Norm - correct the main rule broken was for leaving the track. The 2 guys behind didn't BUT in all fairness it's a rule that usually goes ignored.

[Blatman]

QUOTE

No arguement from me there.

I would say that just because a copper might let one guy off for driving at 46mph in a 40 zone doesn't make it legal. But I wholeheartedly agree that the problem with F1 is the consistency with application of the rules. Fair or unfair LH did break the rule and he's been shown the gallows for it.

No argument, but still some bias. LH and KR *both* broke the rules as laid out. One of them remains unpunished...

[FW500]

Also if it's an offence to leave the circuit shouldn't the run off areas be closed and barriered. Otherwise the race organisers are aiding and abetting the drivers to commit an offence.

Interestingly that's a point raised by Trulli. He pointed out that if the corner had been walled or barriered Hamilton probably wouldn't have attempted the pass.

[FW500]

No arguement from me there.

I would say that just because a copper might let one guy off for driving at 46mph in a 40 zone doesn't make it legal. But I wholeheartedly agree that the problem with F1 is the consistency with application of the rules. Fair or unfair LH did break the rule and he's been shown the gallows for it.

No argument, but still some bias. LH and KR *both* broke the rules as laid out. One of them remains unpunished...

Definately a little biased, but let's face it if I said I wasn't I'd be lying and nobody would believe me anyway.

LH was given a drivethrough - which because it's awarded after the race translates into a 25 second penalty.

KR didn't finish the race and I'm not even sure if they are allowed to hand out drivethroughs to drivers who DNF? Anybody know?

[CedricTheBrave]

QUOTE

KR didn't finish the race and I'm not even sure if they are allowed to hand out drivethroughs to drivers who DNF? Anybody know?

i am sure if it was LH that dnf then he would have had 10 places docked for the next race for leaving the circuit        

[Matt Seabrook]

Every driver is guilty of leaving the track at most races. If you watch them drive through high speed corners at the exit of the corner most if not all have all four wheels over the white line on the exit. If I am not mistaken the part out side the white line is not part of the track as when I raced karts we got told of by the MSA for crossing it.