Ownership costs for a year

[Grunty]

Hi all

Some advice please.

I want to re-mortgage the house to get a Westie (....... & house extension)!

I would hope to budget £9k to buy & run the car for a year before I'd have to sell it again to pay for the rest of the extension.

It would only be for road use but possibly everyday (if I'm only having it for a short time I'm gonna make the most of it!).

I've guessed about £500 for tax & insurance, £8k for a car & £500 for fixing/repairs/maintenance etc. and of course £25 WSCC membership!

After selling it, I reckon a years ownership would in total cost about £1k, much more & it's serious grovelling to SWMBO.

Is this reasonable & have I missed anything ?

What I'd like to know is

1. How much would the car typically de-value in a year?

2. If I'm gonna get one should I get one I really want or just what I can afford. Would a cheap and cheerful car be more economically viable?

3. What sort of car is best (I was hoping for a Zetec or poss VX) bearing in mind I have no mechanical experience & only a few hours at weekends to enjoy it not mend it?

4. Are they more prone to certain expensive failures?

5. Do Westies sell much easier than other makes (can you mention Robin Hood, Tiger etc. on this site?)?

After spending hours on this site reading up on life with the cars I'm both strangely drawn into it all and also scared stiff of whether I can just drive the b****y thing without worrying whether my type 9 3.62LSD ratio bolts are 12.8 grade or not!

Credit to you all, you know your stuff!

Thanks in advance for any comments constructive or otherwise!

[Blatman]

If you have to ask, I think you know the answer!

If residuals and running costs are critical, then a Westfield may not be for you.

Is this reasonable & have I missed anything ?

Yup. Petrol. Using it a lot means going somewhere, usually. When you get there, there are usually drinks or food to buy at least, on top of the petrol.

1. How much would the car typically de-value in a year?

No such thing as typical. They're all different and worth different amounts to different people.

2. If I'm gonna get one should I get one I really want or just what I can afford. Would a cheap and cheerful car be more economically viable?

If it's cheap because it needs "looking after" then no. But then, they all need looking after to a greater or lesser degree...

3. What sort of car is best (I was hoping for a Zetec or poss VX) bearing in mind I have no mechanical experience & only a few hours at weekends to enjoy it not mend it?

A modern, as new as poss 16 valver would present the smallest risk, BUT it must have been built properly..

4. Are they more prone to certain expensive failures?

Again, depends who/how well it's built, whether good quality parts were used, and how it was/is driven. If you have no mechanical experience, then even a service at a local gaage could set you back oner. Break something that's anything less than very minor and you'd be boogered...

5. Do Westies sell much easier than other makes (can you mention Robin Hood, Tiger etc. on this site?)?

Difficult to judge. It's a niche market car, and as such, niche market rules apply and can be subject to violent and surprising price differencies.

FWIW, I spend 7/10th's of your projected 1K ownership costs on rent for the garage I keep one of mine in, and I have two to keep

[pincher]

Hi, I would put your main priority as quality of build. You dont want a car thats been built by a bloke who just got a set of spanners for his birthday. You want to turn the key and drive your pride and joy every day the sun shines without hassel, right ? Also I would'nt worry about the engine type because if you've never driven this type of car, even a meager crossflow will put a beaming smile on your chops untill the extention is well over due. As for budget its an open book. The more you drive the more you pay and depreciation will depend on how you keep it during your time of ownership. Go to your local area meetings and meet the chaps they will be the best investment you can make. Good luck and welcome. Ian. P.S you'll never part with it  

[markcoopers]

I agree with blatman, but i'll wind me neck out a tad further and make some bold sweeping statements that might help of confuse you.

£1000 running costs are I supose reasonable, but this does assume that nothing really breaks. However, joint the AA/RAC

Remember a £4000 car can only loose £4000, a £8000 can loose £8000. Generally speaking these cars bottom out in value around the £4-5000 mark for CVH/Xflow/Pinto and £7-8000 for Zetec/VX.

If you know what you want, then get it as you will be disapointed/asking yourself every day otherwise. Like Blatman says, cheap is fine if built well and in good condition.

The modern 16v have electronic ignigtion and many on fule injection, so to all intents and purposes will behave like a modern car. Further from this and more inherent "characteristics" have to be accepted.

Some Zetec instalations are none to break the thermostat housing if bottomed. Still bottoming the car, the thermostat would be the last on my mind, but some slow speed speed bump interfaces has lead to craked housings. £5 + coolant.

Can't comment on the ease of sale compared to other makes, but can assure you that if the car is taty/dirty etc when you sell it, it will sit on your drive for ages.

If this is your first and you want a road car, relatively quick but comfortable to be in for long trips, cheaper, reliable and easy to work on, then I would suggest a CVH powered car.

Aim for a mid to late 90's car, probaly an SEIW but do not discount the SEW, with a 5speed type 9 gearbox, high back seats and weather gear, and you should have a car for about £5-6K and a good one. Alot of the CVH's are tuned with a can and some head work, so expect about 120-135bhp which is going to be pleanty despite what others may suggest. The CVH was a factory fit option for quite some time, so pleanty around, and should you want to keep it, can be converted to a more powerfull and tunable 16V zetec/VX for about £1.5-£3K at a later date.

Good luck.

[Rory's Dad]

I'd also check out the cost of not having to sell the Westie and think about geting a bigger mortgage.  Saves loosing out on depreciation of the car - can't comment about the house extension.  And I tell you what - you'll feel even less like selling the Westie one year down the road  

You might need to run this past SWMBO    

Rory's Dad

[Hammy]

Don't forget the interest on the mortgage which you will pay for a year - £9000 * 7% = £630... dead money.

Further more if the total cost of this exercise is say £3000* in the first year (my best guess) , then borrowing £3k over say twenty years (the mortgage period) is.... well not IMO the best financial thinking - life time cost say £6000 for one years motoring.

I'm no financial advisor but a mortgage to buy ( sorry "rent") a car is *not* the way forward - what happens in say 3 yrs when you want to do it again, and another 3yrs and an other.. and you are still paying for the first  car!

Is it 1st of April again ?

(* even if its less I hope this illustrates it is a costly method of borrowing money for this usage, and the period of borrowing is especially scary)    

[Blatman]

I disagree on borrowing on the mortgage BUT ONLY IF when you sell the car, the money goes back on to the mortgage. That way, you're only paying interest on any money you lose in depreciation. If you can top up the loss, then so much the better and the mortgage top up is then the cheapest way to borrow money. Much cheaper than a loan, usually...

[Hammy]

. Much cheaper than a loan, usually...

you put the numbers in!

Only per month.... the total cost is much higher over the period of the loan. With a mortgage you pay something like twice (or more) the amount over the period.. and you pay it for a good portion of your life.

If a person continues using borrowing over such long periods  to finance their life then this reduces your future borrowing power and ability to live as you stack up long term debt (you will owe that one years fun for a long time- maybe half your life!).  Ok you think I'll just do this just the once for "the car of a lifetime" (?), but what about next year(holiday of a lifetime) , in five years ( need a new car) etc; when you are borrowed out and suddenly *permantly* skint...

Ask Carol Vordermann... she has been advertising the hoovering of peoples short term CC debt into long term round up loans -its not for charity you end up paying a lot more and she gets paid a good wedge for telling you.

Hammy's  financial services sez...

"A Westfield is a luxury item  (an expenisve one at that)and if you need to finance any of it with a 20+ year loan then IMHO you can't afford it." .. "you should always borrow the least aomunt you can over the shortest period and try to over pay it back"

There is a reason why I've a cheap x/flow !

[DavidR]

If you're really set on having a Westfield and SWMBO agrees then  . . .as long as the mortgage loan amount for the car is only for the year, i.e.borrow and pay back when you sell the car . . . . .then why not buy something like Knightmare's car advertised on here, it ticks the boxes, cheap end of the market, known technology, not much electronics to go wrong and fun driving. I have been running a 1991 CVH on a strict budget for nearly 8 years and it still worth what I paid for it (hopefully). Zetecs and bike engines may have technology sex appeal but for cheap fun an older car will do it.

David

PS no connection with Knightmare, just a suggestion as a possibility.

[Grunty]

Thanks for the advice guys. Its strange how it seems so much clearer when coming from other people not just the green eyed monster in my head!

I think this is a battle of head over heart.

My initial thinking was the extension we need is £35k with approx £25k in building costs. The remaining £10k wouldn't be needed for a while so rather than sit on it I would sit IN it (for about a year anyway)!

Put another way, can I afford to spend £100/month to enjoy driving in to work & bombing around etc.

Typing this with a small tear in my eye has probably just answered that question!        

(PS sorry to talk money instead of cars)

[gixermark]

its still doable - there are cars sub 5k that woudl be sure to put a BIG smile on your dial...

also - dare i mention in on here - but have a look at the other '7's  there are many other cheaper options to westfield - check out piston heads...

Mark.

[Al Yupright]

That 2006 £7K Mazda based Westy that sold recently would have been perfect for this plan.

[Blatman]

QUOTE

Only per month.... the total cost is much higher over the period of the loan. With a mortgage you pay something like twice (or more) the amount over the period.. and you pay it for a good portion of your life.

My point was that I agree with you if you leave the money "out". If the Westfield is sold and the money put back in to the mortgage then the long term costs are mitigated, which I already said...

[Rory's Dad]

That 2006 £7K Mazda based Westy that sold recently would have been perfect for this plan.

The depreciation on that car was shocking    

... which does point you in the right direction  

Rory's Dad

[Hammy]

Agreed Blatman