English or Atlas Axle

[RobK]

Been out for a blat in our Westfield today. All went well until we heard a strange noise from the diff. We pulled up and tried to push the car to the side of the road. Usually it pushes very easily.

On this occasion (out of gear!) it was sometimes hard and sometimes easy to push as the diff rotated. There was also an occasional clunk noise from the diff area. Managed to limp the car home at 30mph.

We are unsure if this is an english or atlas axle, we think its an english. Can anyone clarify this from the picture below.

Which ever diff it is, what may the problems be? Are there any known problems with that diff.

Thanks in advance

[Paul Ash]

English axle.

Jack back of car up, put in gear. try and rotate wheels. This will cause the diff to work (crown wheel inside remains stationary)and one wheel to rotate opposite to the other (providing lsd not fitted) this will give you a fair indication if it is a wheel bearing.

Remove filler bung, get a piece of wire & dip the oil. Check level / colour / smell.

From there car in neutral. supported on axle stands. grab hold of the propshaft & give a turn by hand, see how it feels. if it is going loose & tight. check the input flange for any movement laterelly.

Undo propshaft from flange & retry above. if still in axle further investigation needed.

If now rotating freely problem in gearbox.

[RobK]

Thanks for the info, we will get it looked at this week.

Since the slow drive home its not made any noises and the car seems to push freely now. If its driven and "something" breaks will we more than likely just free wheel to a stop or could it break in such a way that the diff locks up and then risks breaking the gearbox, shocking the engine and possible taking us off the road?

The car didn't feel as smooth on decent roads and i commented twice that the car had a vibration and seemed different to last time it went out.

[RobK]

Had a look at the diff and can find not a lot wrong. Did all the tests listed above and all seems ok. Added oil to it, it needed 300-350ml of oil. We have had our first night time drive           . We have noticed a slight clicking from the diff.

Not present while accelerating or holding a speed, only time we can hear it is on a trailing throttle. Its not that loud     and it probably did make it before. We are going to look at getting a spare diff. Whats peoples thoughts??? Will it last long and is it safe to drive?

[Hammy]

This sort of thing is almost impossible to diagnose on a forum and its a bit dangerous to say "yep its fine".

do check that:  

- you've nothing wrapped around the propshaft or nothing is hitting with two up.

- You haven't a duff U/J - these often "tick" when failed (check for u/j play and/or drop the back of the shaft off and rotate the joint side to side check for grittyness/play

- one of the brake brakes isn't the source (jack up rotate with/without drum).- whilst here use a screwdriver near the hub as a stethoscope and check for hub bearing noise (worn bearings here are often noiser on a bend when in running neutral)

- Take the diff out and have a good look at it, feel for roughness. You may just have a worn bearing which can be quickly replaced (don't get jetwashing it or sandblasting to clean). look at the conditon of the oil coming out - any particles in it ??

BTW, I'm sure others will disagree but IMHO I always think thats a dodgy place for the battery. A rear ender will push the tank into the axle, which is turn will squash the battery = fire (worse with the +ve hanging over the axle like you have.

-No offence like but...You have a lot of "stuff" shoved down the tunnel near the diff  casing something could easily be getting squashed and transmiiting noises through the body with two up (Personally I'd strip the lot out when you've found the problem, repaint the casing, move the battey and put it all back again with things tidied up routed and secured properly).

Good luck.

[RobK]

Thanks for the advice Hammy  

We have checked the brakes so I am pretty sure thats not the problem. We have had the car in the air to check that nothing is rubbing against the diff, so thats not the cause. Duff UJ sounds a good idea and we have yet to check that. Think we'll take the diff out too (once we have a spare to be on the safe side!) and have a good look at it.

We know there is a lot of stuff slotted in to the back, however, we have only recently bought the car, and other things have had to take priority first. Changed the gearbox a couple of weeks back for example. As I said we have checked the tunnel to make sure the fuel lines and battery cables are clear of the diff. Ideally we would like to relocate the battery, any creative ideas where it could go?? There is no room under the bonnet to locate it (can post a pic if needed). In fact the passenger footwell is already about 8 inch shorter to accomodate the ait filter and fuel injection system.

Thanks again!

[Hammy]

I got a diff from a fellow club member - they do appear from time to time, and there is a risk (but mines pretty tired with a lot of backlash, so I took the chance). - Every member I've met so far seems dead straight.

Keep up the good work.

The battery problem ...I now see your problem, might be worth posting a question asking that question - there are some small gell batteries around which might help. Some cars have them down the front by the rad. Other people do have them at the back, but I've only seen that on independant rear ends .

[Martin Keene]

There is no room under the bonnet to locate it (can post a pic if needed). In fact the passenger footwell is already about 8 inch shorter to accomodate the ait filter and fuel injection system.

Eh? What the hells in it...

[John Loudon - Sponsorship Liaison]

That is the ideal place for the battery on a track car as it helps offset the drivers weight. Howver, I would get something smaller as the terminals and cables look prime for shorting out due to contact and rubbing.

PS - what engine have you got? Its unusual for the air filter to clash with the passenger footwell!

[RobK]

The photo actually makes the terminals look a bit closer than they are, there is about 12mm clearancle to the axle. Still not an idea situation though.

The car has a 2.0 pinto under the bonnet, but was turbocharged sometime ago by Turbo Technics. In addition to the 'standard' stuff, there is the turbo (of course!) and its associated pipe work, an oil radiator, the intercooler, and custom inlet manifold. Where I believe the battery normally sits is a Bosch K-Jetronic mechanical fuel injection system, and underneath it sits the air filter, hence why the passencer footwell is shorter than normal.

Would a smaller battery manage to crank and start a 2.0 pinto? To be honest, starting from cold is the worst bit about this car. Always fires up straight away when warm though.

[Hammy]

Not connected to me but there is a diff for sale on the parts for sale bit - only £50 !

[hilux]

Correct me if I`m wrong but if thats a loose fuel pipe and a loose battery cable flapping around near a rotating prop flange I personally would reclip/reroute asap before I ever drove it again.

[RobK]

The battery cables and fuel pipe are secured the full length of the tunnel, so they cant hit the prop or the flange. At this end the fuel line tends not to move much since its braided. At worst the battery cables may bounce off the diff casing now and then, the cables dont show any signs of wear, is this a problem?

Cheers

[hilux]

I personally feel that fuel and sparks dont mix if one or other or both chafe and that if secured ok its not a problem.

I PERSONALLY would spend a little time securing them so that they were free of the axle/housing. Remember that the axle/diff housing will be moving up and down and vibrating a lot.

While on the subject may I assume (as its not clear in the photo) that the hose from the brake line `tee` going forward under the tunnel is a flexible and not a rigid pipe? If its is rigid then you need to urgently change it for a flexible.

I`m not nit picking just helping out where I can. Tell me to p*ss off if you want    

[RobK]

No offence taken, in fact all constructive criticism welcome  

The hose from the brake line is a flexible one, so no worries there  

The cables could do with better securing, the fuse (which has been pointed out elsewhere) is due to be sorted, so we may as well sort the cables the same time.

As we said else where, we bought the car only recently, quite cheaply, and are doing it up as we go.

Anyway cable will have to wait a short while as the head is comming off the engine this weekend while we check out some other problems  

Thanks again.