Sam Posted March 4, 2006 Posted March 4, 2006 Just fitted my new wheels, and according to the instructions there should ba at least 6 full turns of the nut on the studs. However the studs only reach about half way through the nut. Is this ok?? btw i have 8 full turns? Does it seem that i would need longer studs? or should i just be happy with my 8 turns?? Quote
DAVE O Posted March 4, 2006 Posted March 4, 2006 No - you need longer the studs should be right through the nuts.... Dave O Quote
adhawkins Posted March 4, 2006 Posted March 4, 2006 CAT Motorsport or Rally Design are the first two places that spring to mind. Andy Quote
adamnreeves Posted March 4, 2006 Posted March 4, 2006 Hello Sam, I had the same issue with my studs at the rear. Most of the on-line motor factors and kit car suppliers including westfield do the extended bolts. You need to get the ford fitment which are splined the bolt size is M12 X 1.5 (course thread) There are two extended sizes over the standard, I went for the longest which is 63mm. I had to cut the bolts down. Like I say I have done this recently and I have documented this here and go to 4 Feb 2006 Quote
Sam Posted March 4, 2006 Author Posted March 4, 2006 The only thing is, the new nuts that came with the wheels are about twice the depth of the original sierra nuts. I would think that the original nuts would be just about the right thickness? Should i stick with the original ones allowing me to keep the shorter studs??? or replace the studs and use the new nuts......seeing as the hubs and breaks are all mounted and changing the studs now would be alot of work...... Quote
adamnreeves Posted March 4, 2006 Posted March 4, 2006 The only thing is, the new nuts that came with the wheels are about twice the depth of the original sierra nuts. I would think that the original nuts would be just about the right thickness? Should i stick with the original ones allowing me to keep the shorter studs??? or replace the studs and use the new nuts......seeing as the hubs and breaks are all mounted and changing the studs now would be alot of work...... as long as you are at least 12 threads down the stud or 18mm then that will be okay. The westfield open ended nuts are 24mm deep so if the original nuts are 12mm deep then you need 8mm of bolt sticking out from the nut. Any less than this then it is recommend that you install longer studs. Quote
Blatman Posted March 4, 2006 Posted March 4, 2006 then you need 8mm of bolt sticking out from the nut. Crap. The stud only needs to finish level with the end of the nut. The extra 8mm isn't doing much as it's only tightening up on thin air... As for your stud problem, the 10mm of visible shank just isn't a problem 'cos the wheel nut will *never* reach it. Quote
adamnreeves Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 then you need 8mm of bolt sticking out from the nut. Crap. The stud only needs to finish level with the end of the nut. The extra 8mm isn't doing much as it's only tightening up on thin air... As for your stud problem, the 10mm of visible shank just isn't a problem 'cos the wheel nut will *never* reach it. 1. Blatman, there is not need for that language! And as far as stud length is concerned I was only quoting what you said: Blatman Posted on Mar. 11 2005,13:56 "If you have open ended wheel nuts, as long as the ends of the studs are level with the open end of the nut, you'll be fine. The actual tolerance for thread engagement is 1.5 x stud diameter, so for an M12 stud, 18mm of thread engagement in the nut is OK." In which you state the minimum is really 1.5 X 12 = 18mm. The open ended nuts are 24mm. So please make your mind up whether you think is should be 12, 18 or 24mm! I do see what you mean about thin air but as I take the minimum of 18mm seriously, then I would use nuts that are at least 18mm in that case. 2. The issue of the stud shoulder length of the standard ford studs on the front hubs was pointed out to me by Westfield Sportcars otherwise I would never have noticed it. The bolt hole in my wheels is just about 10mm, so I might have a problem torquing up if the nuts bottom out on these shoulders. Quote
Guest Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 it is possible to bottom out the nuts as i had to turn down the shank on my longer studs on the wheels i had .......... be very careful with extended studs that there is enough thread out of the hub .........some offsets and wheels have thin areas in the collar ....... also standard sierra sierra nuts are proberbly for steel wheels and have a different angle on the nut to the ones designed for alloy wheels never use steel type wheel nuts on alloy wheels they can pull through. Quote
Blatman Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 1. Blatman, there is not need for that language! And as far as stud length is concerned I was only quoting what you said:Blatman Posted on Mar. 11 2005,13:56 "If you have open ended wheel nuts, as long as the ends of the studs are level with the open end of the nut, you'll be fine. The actual tolerance for thread engagement is 1.5 x stud diameter, so for an M12 stud, 18mm of thread engagement in the nut is OK." In which you state the minimum is really 1.5 X 12 = 18mm. The open ended nuts are 24mm. So please make your mind up whether you think is should be 12, 18 or 24mm! I do see what you mean about thin air but as I take the minimum of 18mm seriously, then I would use nuts that are at least 18mm in that case. Good engineering practice is that a nut should engage a thread by a minimum of 1.5 x the diameter of the bolt. No if's no buts. If the nut in question is shorter than the minimum depth required, then as long as the thread reaches the end of the nut it'll be fine as any thread outside the nut isn't doing anything. I never thought I'd actually have to explain that a thread in thin air is not offering any sort of clamping force! You really worry me sometmes... Quote
adamnreeves Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 also standard sierra sierra nuts are proberbly for steel wheels and have a different angle on the nut to the ones designed for alloy wheels never use steel type wheel nuts on alloy wheels they can pull through. A very good point. Quote
adamnreeves Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 1. Blatman, there is not need for that language! And as far as stud length is concerned I was only quoting what you said:Blatman Posted on Mar. 11 2005,13:56 "If you have open ended wheel nuts, as long as the ends of the studs are level with the open end of the nut, you'll be fine. The actual tolerance for thread engagement is 1.5 x stud diameter, so for an M12 stud, 18mm of thread engagement in the nut is OK." In which you state the minimum is really 1.5 X 12 = 18mm. The open ended nuts are 24mm. So please make your mind up whether you think is should be 12, 18 or 24mm! I do see what you mean about thin air but as I take the minimum of 18mm seriously, then I would use nuts that are at least 18mm in that case. Good engineering practice is that a nut should engage a thread by a minimum of 1.5 x the diameter of the bolt. No if's no buts. If the nut in question is shorter than the minimum depth required, then as long as the thread reaches the end of the nut it'll be fine as any thread outside the nut isn't doing anything. I never thought I'd actually have to explain that a thread in thin air is not offering any sort of clamping force! You really worry me sometmes... Not my point, at least not since my 3rd post. If your statement of 1.5 X 12mm being the minimum is a valid engineering principle and I have no reason or experience to question this really, then does that not mean that 18mm of threads should be engaged in the nut? If so then this means a nut having at least 18mm of thread should be employed. As far as worrying you; I worry me! I guess that is probably why I spend a lot of time in this newbie section. Quote
Blatman Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 If so then this means a nut having at least 18mm of thread should be employed. I guess I didn't realise that you would take me 100% literally and not think beyond what's said here. I hope you don't do that all the time with the replys here as some of them have left a bit to be desired Quote
adamnreeves Posted March 5, 2006 Posted March 5, 2006 If so then this means a nut having at least 18mm of thread should be employed. I guess I didn't realise that you would take me 100% literally and not think beyond what's said here. I hope you don't do that all the time with the replys here as some of them have left a bit to be desired Mark, Wherever I can I do try and verify answers to my questions by research and/or different sources of information. One of my failings in life, is taking things too literally; I have been a software engineer for 20 years. I do respect your advice... no honestly. Quote
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