LiamR Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 Hi all. OK, so this may be a bit premature, as I do not pick my (first) westie up until the weekend (hopefully) I have bought a 92 Narrow Body, with a pinto engine, and 4 speed box. My first plan was to change it for a 5 speed this winter. However, my brother has told me that he is about to sell his 93' Mondeo 2.0si soon. However, the engine and gearbox are still very good. What I want to know is, what engine is in the Mondeo (I think it may be a Zetec, but am unsure) and how easy is it to remove the pinto, and fit this engine? Could I use the Mondeo gearbox? What other things would I need to take into account (Exhaust, carbs etc) I am a bit nervous, as this seems a bit like a baptism of fire. But I do not want to waste the chance of a cheap but good engine and box, if it is a change worth doing. Are there companies / people that could do this change, and what would I expect to pay to get it done? - If I bottle it! If it all seems to hard, and not worth it, then I wont bother, but any thoughts would be much appriciated. Cheers Liam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adhawkins Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 It's certainly possible. The Zetec is one of the 'standard' Westfield engines. I think the exhaust exit is on the opposite side to the Pinto. You won't be able use the Mondeo gearbox, that'll be for a front wheel drive installation. You'll need an MT75 or a Type 9. Like I say, it's certainly doable. Someone a little more 'expert' than me will be along soon Just enjoy the car you're getting for a little while first would be my advice! Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiamR Posted May 16, 2005 Author Share Posted May 16, 2005 Doh... another silly moment with the gearbox.... for a moment I forgot which wheels I want turning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 You'll need an MT75 or a Type 9. And you'll need to check your chassis cos it has a wider tunnel when fitting an MT75 gearbox which won't fit into an older chassis but a type 9 is just fine and fits in either chassis variant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markcoopers Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Ok just out of interest why do you want to change the engine? I assume yours is a 2Lt? I know we take the p*** out of the pinto, but cards on table, it's tourquey, can be tuned to give 180ish Bhp quite easily and will be both very fast and relaxing on the road. If you do want to change, you will need about £2500-£3000, and a parts list as long as your arm, and still have probably about the same bhp and probably less tourque. Plays Kool, and i'm sure others could do the work for you, but you will need more money. Why you changing to a 5sp box, this will esentially have an extra override gear only, unless you are going to purchase a close ratio or some other "serious" bit of kit. If this is the case, have you considered "serious" bits of kit 4sp?? I can think of 2 for sale at the moment for less than £400. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I agree with all of that, except and still have probably about the same bhp and probably less tourque. The volumetric efficiency of a 16 valver over all but the wildest of 8 valvers will mean that even a mildly tuned Zetec will produce torque that the Pinto can only dream about... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiamR Posted May 18, 2005 Author Share Posted May 18, 2005 Thanks guys. The reason for me thinking about this, was mainly due to reading a lot of the posts, that have given me the impression that I will never get that much punch out of the pinto. However, if I thought I may be able to get upto 180bhp out of it, I am sure that would be more than plenty for 'my first westie'. As for the gearbox, I have been told that with the 4 speed box I am going to find long runs tiring (Le Mans) and costly in fuel. Also that if I do track days, I may suffer because the top speed will frustrate me? Again... all comments very much appriciated. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enterpryse Posted May 18, 2005 Share Posted May 18, 2005 I think the exhaust exit is on the opposite side to the Pinto. Zetec/Pinto....the exhaust does exit on the other side- just a consideration if filling & drilling holes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
predawson Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 and still have probably about the same bhp and probably less tourque. The volumetric efficiency of a 16 valver over all but the wildest of 8 valvers will mean that even a mildly tuned Zetec will produce torque that the Pinto can only dream about... Every torque curve comparison I've ever seen Zetec vs Pinto with the same BHP show the pinto having more torque. This includes torque curves from Engine builders that build pinto's and Zetec's. Not saying your wrong. Just reporting what I've seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
predawson Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 Hi all. OK, so this may be a bit premature, as I do not pick my (first) westie up until the weekend (hopefully) I have bought a 92 Narrow Body, with a pinto engine, and 4 speed box. My first plan was to change it for a 5 speed this winter. However, my brother has told me that he is about to sell his 93' Mondeo 2.0si soon. However, the engine and gearbox are still very good. What I want to know is, what engine is in the Mondeo (I think it may be a Zetec, but am unsure) and how easy is it to remove the pinto, and fit this engine? Could I use the Mondeo gearbox? What other things would I need to take into account (Exhaust, carbs etc) I am a bit nervous, as this seems a bit like a baptism of fire. But I do not want to waste the chance of a cheap but good engine and box, if it is a change worth doing. Are there companies / people that could do this change, and what would I expect to pay to get it done? - If I bottle it! If it all seems to hard, and not worth it, then I wont bother, but any thoughts would be much appriciated. Cheers Liam IMO the jump from pinto to Zetec isn't worth it. As pointed out it will leave holes in the body + cost loads for little benefit. The Zetec isn't much lighter than the pinto. I would enjoy the pinto for a few years and start saving for a duratec. That's my plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell O'Neill Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 do a true upgrade, fit a VX ...... Taxi for Mr. O'Neill....... edited to say, not meant as real advice, I've just waited months to get a chance to say it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markcoopers Posted May 19, 2005 Share Posted May 19, 2005 Evening Liam. Interesting couple of points you make. Yes, take a few bhp figures with a pinch of salt, as when quoted these could be peoples estimates, RR figures adjusted for temp/pressure transmission losses or even perhaps a propper dyno cell. To be honest the number might as well be quoted in potatoes for the direct relevance it brings. When looking at performance tuning an engine you should always consider what you have and what you want. If you already have "150", then a jump to "160" might be disapointing whears if you've only "90", "160" is going to seam increadable. The point being it is still the same 160, but your starting point is going to be so different. It is also vital that you consider how the bhp is developed. A lot of people here have Bike engined cars, perhaps only putting out 130ish bhp which could be identical to your 130bhp. However the way it is developed is what makes all the difference in the experience. A a general rule of thumb, tuning any engine (no forced induction) will always push the bhp higher, but the band it is made in will become narrower. Having said all that, for a trully fast machien Tourque is what is important, but that gets glossed over. " bhp wins sales, Tourque wins races". Understand the comment about the box, but put it into perspective. It's a westfield, not a mondeo. It will always be noisy, hard riding, smell of petrol and be tiering on a long drive regardles of the box fitted. Fule economy is perhaps not to be ignored, but then driving with a gentle right foot would fix that, and I doubt you would even consider that. Maxing it in top again I understand the point, but a choice of sensibe diff coupled with sensible box ratios would be an easy fix. Matt Seabrook on here posted a video of him at Hullavington airfield. His car I believe is a very high powered VX with a 4sp box, and Hullavington has something like a 1km straight and it didn't seam to be an issue for him. All I'm saying is consider all options first but don't forget what you have is pretty good to start with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiamR Posted May 19, 2005 Author Share Posted May 19, 2005 Once again, thanks guys.... So I think I will stick with what I have got for now, until I have the experience to know what I want to change! Also... I have just agreed to collect the car from Nottingham tomorrow evening, and drive back to London, so tonight I am feeling like a 5 year old on Christmas eve! Just hoping to be able to sleep tonight now..... Liam oh... and keeping my fingers crossed that it gets me back to London in one go!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve L Posted May 20, 2005 Share Posted May 20, 2005 Hi, first of all congratulations! I have a '91 Westy SE with 125 bhp, and it is more than enough for me as a beginner. I too have a 4 speed and am sick of it. I have bought a 5 speed type 9 and plan to install it this winter. My reasons were: gearstick way up under the dash so that I had to move my seat forward just to get 3rd gear, and I could find no shift extension for the type 2 box; 1st gear is so short that I just barely start to move and have to shift to 2nd; I do want the overdrive because where I live, I have to drive 30 minutes on the Autobahn to get anywhere fun to drive. I looked into the various types of type 9 in this forum and others and learned that there are lots available but only one version, the N3, makes sense, as it has relatively close gearing. Unless I have my names mixed up, AdHawkins has put a copy of some files about the type 9 that I found on his server. Has info about the various ratios and what engines they are mated to. Or get one that was in a CateringVan. That is where mine came from. But the best advice was already posted above: drive it first and have fun. Cheers, Steve L Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 20, 2005 Share Posted May 20, 2005 fit this and really notice the improvement go faster :Complete Dodge Viper Engine 8.3 V10 500 bhp 100 Miles Complete Dodge Viper Engine 8.3 V10 500 bhp with 525 pounds-feet of torque at 4,100 RPM Comes with loom and all ECU\'s Engine has covered less than 100 miles so you can say its new Engine is complete and will be ready for delivery collection in 2 weeks Send me your best offer. Best offer takes it away Price £4000 Location East Anglia p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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