Who's car is it?

[SootySport]

Took the Benz in for yearly service this morning. Service manager  came back to me with keys ready for me to go home and said  " the towbar that was fitted and front AMG grille are not approved by M Benz and deactivating the lane departure and start/stop is not allowed on our cars"

In reply from me " It's my car, I can do what I like to it"

Manager shakes his head and shows me the service invoice.

Looking at the invoice I say "I could go to another garage for a better price and more amiable attitude"

He replies " I don't think so"

Before I laid into him, I just paid the bill and left.

Is this what it's like in main dealers now?

 

[Stuart]

At a recall in early January, BMW main dealer told me that one of our X3 front tyres was down to the cords. It passed an MoT in March and there's still 3mm on it now after a good few thousand miles.  

 

They also gave me a price for replacing a leaky diff oil seal then tried to double it when I booked it in. 

 

Not the first time I've caught them out either. Cheats & thieves and they'll never get another penny from me.  

 

[BigSkyBrad]

Mercedes owns 90% of Mitsubishi Fuso truck, which is the base for our camper truck.

 

When we had an injector failure (see in the Build Diary section), we got recovered to an Iveco garage which at the time I was happy about as the Iveco and Fuso have the same engine. However, when it came time to recode the new injectors on the ECU, they couldn't get to make the changes to 'save'. Although most modern trucks have the same J1939 protocol via OBD2, Fuso (MB) have a security blanket over the software. I had to nurse the truck up north to a Fuso workshop (there's only three in Scotland) to get them to do the recoding. What I didn't know was that any ECU recoding that needs to be done on UK Fusos has to be done by Fuso UK. The workshop does the recoding work using Fuso Connect, but the actual 'save' on the ECU is performed by a tech guy at Fuso UK down in England who wifi-remotes into the Connect while it is plugged into the truck - and there literally is only one guy that does the approving, what happens when he is on holiday! Ridiculous

 

To throw another spanner in the works, while driving to the Fuso workshop, the potentiometer in the fly-by-wire accelerator pedal decided to throw a wobbly. The truck went into limp mode, so I had to get recovered to there. The accelerator also needed to be recorded.

 

After all that was sorted, we were back on the road - but not for long. We knew the exhaust brake solenoid was faulty, but we were getting along ok without it. What we didn't realise was that the truck uses it to perform exhaust regenerations, both passively and actively. After the dash lit up with warnings, and the truck refusing to perform a roadside regen, we had to do a long motorway drive so that the engine could passively regen enough to drop the warning, and take it back to the Fuso workshop for another two weeks. I found a solenoid online for £350 (made by the same OEM manufacturer) and would have fitted it myself but was unsure if it needed to be coded on the ECU, so got the workshop to do the work. They would not let me supply the solenoid I found, they had to use one from Fuso UK for warranty reasons - £900! - for the same exact item, from the same Piersburg manufacturer! And to rub it in, the invoice after the work was done made no mention of/charge for recoding the solenoid.

 

Basically, they have my wallet by the balls!

 

Bring back the days of carburetors and six fuses for the whole car!

 

 

 

[Kit Car Electronics]

It's a tricky one really - MB are responsible for any future safety recalls and could be liable if your car was involved in an accident where a de-activated lane departure system could be questioned, for example. Also start/stop is part of the homologated emissions so I can see their point on those. Not sure about a towbar that has its own certification though - that seems a bit petty to be questioned, unless the car was never homologated for towing.

[dvd8n]

I'm not sure about what you are saying about the start/stop.  A car will meet emissions regs with or without start/stop; start/stop is more about maximising things like mpg for publicity and documentation and tax bands and meeting stuff like CAFE regulations.  Once the car's out of the dealership then it doesn't matter.  I think that it's more about control.

 

D

[SootySport]

Towbar &car and car approved and car Max Moving Weight Is 2995k.

'Control' is what it's all about despite the Right To Repair agreements in some countries.  Notably Tesla and Apple think it doesn't to apply to then, many other manufacturers are on the same path. 

[dvd8n]

10 minutes ago, SootySport said:

Towbar &car and car approved and car Max Moving Weight Is 2995k.

'Control' is what it's all about despite the Right To Repair agreements in some countries.  Notably Tesla and Apple think it doesn't to apply to then, many other manufacturers are on the same path. 

Don't forget John Deere.  They've destroyed their reputation in North America by going down this path.

 

D

[Kit Car Electronics]

12 hours ago, dvd8n said:

I'm not sure about what you are saying about the start/stop.  A car will meet emissions regs with or without start/stop; start/stop is more about maximising things like mpg for publicity and documentation and tax bands and meeting stuff like CAFE regulations.  Once the car's out of the dealership then it doesn't matter.  I think that it's more about control.

 

D

 

Emission homologation includes CO2 which is directly impacted by start/stop, so yes it does matter.

[jeff oakley]

I do not believe under the right to repair law that any manufacturer can do this. It did start with BMW trying to circumvent the EU laws by making them the only ones who could recode a new tyre being fitted or a bulb as they were "safety related". They lost that case and now you can do those jobs anywhere.

 

I was involved in the right to repair campaign and went to the Department Of Transport to discuss legislation with them. The motor manufacturers sent 5 heavy duty law types and three technical experts from Europe to argue the case. Their view was only approved and fully trained technicians by the manufacturers should be allowed to work on vehicles as all makes were not able to be fully trained.

 

They lost but have become evermore inventive in getting around this and dealers try their best to say if you do not have service by them no warranty is allowed etc.

 

I am sure there will be some enterprising types who will find a way around these issues but DVLA have stated targeting some of those who modify ECU for Pop and Bang, using environmental laws 

 

 

 

[Blatman]

On 02/12/2023 at 17:29, Kit Car Electronics said:

It's a tricky one really - MB are responsible for any future safety recalls and could be liable if your car was involved in an accident where a de-activated lane departure system could be questioned, for example. Also start/stop is part of the homologated emissions so I can see their point on those. Not sure about a towbar that has its own certification though - that seems a bit petty to be questioned, unless the car was never homologated for towing.

 

Does the ECU log driver actions, like deactivating lane departure, cancelling the stop/start etc?

[Kit Car Electronics]

17 hours ago, Blatman said:

 

Does the ECU log driver actions, like deactivating lane departure, cancelling the stop/start etc?

potentially yes, various events could be recorded around the time of a crash sensor activation, for example. Also, modem equipped cars can stream quite a lot of data for manufacturer analysis (eg. to improve products by learning better how they are really used)

[corsechris]

It seems the only way to get fair treatment and pricing from a dealer these days is to buy Korean. All the others are total p***-taking rip-off merchants imo.  

[Blatman]

Or never buy a car from a main stealer. I am committed to being a cheapskate and with the imediate depreciation hit once driving off the forecourt, a low mileage car that's a few years old is eminently more appealing, as are non-franchise specialists. My recent experience of Ford and BMW non-franchise specialists has been excellent.

[SootySport]

Lucky for me, AMG models are covered with 2 years warranty from a main stealer, I thought it was pretty good for peice of mind.

As for depreciation, you'll always loose heavily if you chop and change cars regularly, keep them 10 years and and it's not so bad.

[Captain Colonial]

Bought a used 20 plate Skoda Octavia from a main stealer back in August, when my 05 plate Volvo S60 D5 was consigned to history after a long and glorious run.  Very good price, below Parker guide price, FSH, 23k miles, like new.  Very pleased with the car.

 

Before I picked it up, they did all the software / firmware updates that were due.

 

Shortly afterwards, when driving with the active cruise control on, it flat refused to overtake other vehicles at any speed.  Lean out to overtake, zero acceleration unless I overrode it manually.

 

Back to the dealer, can’t find anything wrong sir…

 

Neighbour has an Audi A3 and an OBD11 device.  He plugged it into the Skoda’s OBD2 port and it communicated with his smartphone.  Few minutes later and he found the problem - the software update was from VAG and the default for the active cruise control is to prevent overtaking on the right, where it’s illegal in Germany.  Quick swipe to disable the restriction and problem cured.

 

It’s faintly ridiculous that my neighbour, a local GP, knows more about it with a £50 device and his smartphone then a main stealer does.