Nick.Petty Posted March 6, 2003 Share Posted March 6, 2003 Picking up first Westy on Saturday - 1988 car with 1700 xflow in really nice condition but purchased as a basis for track day - potentially going 2.016v Vauxhall route but not sure if pre 1990 Westfield chassis has limitation as to engine instal, i.e. any restrictions on the lump you can drop in ? Car will mainly be trailered to the track but of course Sunday morning use also ! Any advice welcomed. Want to get to at least 180bhp/quaife box and lsd. What are these SBD boys like ? Don't know if I've got the hang of these message boards either, but if this works, all replies will be most appreciated ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chazpowerslide Posted March 7, 2003 Share Posted March 7, 2003 Hi Nick is this a pre-lit or post lit car ? 87/88 was about the time they crossed over. If it's a pre-lit the door sills will slope down from the scuttle to the rear arches, the bottom edge of the main boby tub between the rear aeches forward to the nose has a fairly "sharp" angle as it turnes under the car, the post lit cars are are very rounded in this area and the spare wheel space on the rear is flat not "sunk in" like the later cars. You will also see a concave curve moulded into the body that runs either side of the car from the nose to the scuttle if it's a post lit car. If it's a pre-lit you'll struggle to put a modern 16v in, also some of the early post-lit cars had "low line" bodywork and the 16v engines are too tall for this also. If you do a search under my user name you will turn up some more info as I have a pre-lit that is undergoing a full re-build and have posted on this subject. This car has the body from a 1992 SE which is a perfect no mods needed. I found out that the pre-lit body was too shallow to fit an XE engine and as the "low line" is a similar depth. People have fitted the modern 16v engines to the earlier cars but the sump clearence will be marginal or the bulge required in the bonnet will be very big!!!! HTH Chaz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAULIE Posted March 7, 2003 Share Posted March 7, 2003 Nick,I'm adding a Rover K in my alloy pre lit with a shallow sump from Caterhummm.The clearance under the bonnet ment I'll have to add a very small bulge to clear the inlet manifold.There is also another pre lit owned by Paulleo 72 fitted with a 2.0 Zetec(I think). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulleo 72 Posted March 8, 2003 Share Posted March 8, 2003 hi all, i have a zetec in my pre lit like chaz says the sump is very low on clearance but is ok as long as your a little careful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon H Posted March 8, 2003 Share Posted March 8, 2003 Nick, I've got a Rover K Series in my plastic pre-lit and I can just squeeze it under the bonnet line. I have also got a cateringvan shallow sump on it and that gives about 85mm ground clearance. I think the plastic pre-lits and the low-line post lit cars are about the same height at the front of the bonnet which is the only place there seemed to be any clearance issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick.Petty Posted March 8, 2003 Author Share Posted March 8, 2003 Simon/Chaz/Paulie/paulleo 72 Many thanks for your advice/comments. From Chaz's post I think I have a post-lit car but lowline body. Have seen a K Series advertised for £600 and am familiar with engine due to previous track day Elise and current road car being Freelander 1.8. If this lump is used what gearboxes mate up and what sort of power can you extract ? This website is fantastic ! I thought I had the only Westie for example with a dodgy gearstick mounted under the bulkhead but now I have searched the postings and find its a common issue and there are solutions. Also oil problem with xflow and I see this mentioned also with regard to breathers and catch tank installs. Blinking top dollar. Cheers, Nick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon H Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 You can get a bellhousing from Titan Motorsport for the K to fit to a Type 9 box for about £180 all in. My K currently has about 140 bhp with a lightly ported head, fast road inlet cam and 160VVC throttle body. I had to make a squashed plenum to save me putting a lump in the bonnet. I am going to fit a VHPD/VVC head in the autumn with throttles which should be about 190 bhp. Simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chazpowerslide Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 Hi Nick, have you looked at the Toyota 4AGE engine. I looked into this in a lot of detail and the 4AGE motor is not that much bigger than than your existing Xflow and will fit without resorting to major surgery of the bonnet ect. The engine in Phase1 form is a "poor man's" Cosworth BDA. Toyota reputidly produced a "productionised" BDA copy and as such is a fairly high specificatoin road engine of 1600cc, 16 valve alloy head and a steel crankshaft. This motor will produce circa 150BHP on 45DCOE and a 3D ignition system. The Phase 2 engine is the next development and has a stronger block, stronger crank and rods and a better head (IRRC bigger valves and revised porting) and is regarded as the engine to go for as it makes circa 150-160BHP with DCOE carbs and 3D ignition. This engine has smaller inlet ports than the Phase 3 engine which had enlarged ports as part of the TVIS inlet system employed on that engine. The Phase 3 TVIS engine makes slightly less BHP due to it's larger inlet ports but is essentially the same as the Phase 2. You then have the Phase 4 engines or the 4AGZE which are supercharged, 20 valve and can make up to 200bhp with little modification (though you'll really struggle to fit one of these to a Westfield as the blower sits where the steering shaft needs to be) The Phase 1,2and 3 engines have a clear upgrade path to 170-180 bhp with a rev limit of around 8-8500rpm. Check out Raw Engineering here Chaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatman Posted March 13, 2003 Share Posted March 13, 2003 Second Chaz's advice re the 4AGE engine. Can't believe the K series was mentioned without any putting a link up to Dave Andrews homepage........A K series would also be well worth considering in a pre-lit/low-line car........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B George Posted March 13, 2003 Share Posted March 13, 2003 Hi Nick, you're my hero! Seriously though, will the 4AGE go straight in and run off of the original gearbox??? Doubt it somehow. How much for a 4AGE and which car/s did it go into originally? Thanks for all the help on this subject chaps, I have a share in Nicko's motor and therefore feel that you ought to know that due to excess lard, we need more power basically! Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B George Posted March 13, 2003 Share Posted March 13, 2003 Chaz - that link dont seem to work??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oioi Posted March 13, 2003 Share Posted March 13, 2003 another option which hasnt been mentioned is that it is possible to go bike engined. any engine swap is going to be expensive, and a bike engine swap not neccesarily more so (you get a free sequential gear box with every engine ) why go on a diet when you can put the car on an extreme weight loss program a blackbird engine will give you a a similar (better possibly) power to weight ratio as 200bhp Vx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick.Petty Posted March 13, 2003 Author Share Posted March 13, 2003 Just thought I should point out that it's Barny's lard and not mine that is causing this weight problem, therefore costing us all the dosh. On a serious note, Do either the K Series or the 4age utilise the existing engine mounts? I telephoned the factory today and they informed me that they do not make different engine mounts for the early SE cars. Being mechanically inept (some would say Barny's driving is equally inept) I would not know where to start if the mounts need modifying. No doubt someone somewhere will be able to tell me though ?! Many thanks, Nick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stanton Posted March 13, 2003 Share Posted March 13, 2003 I telephoned the factory today and they informed me that they do not make different engine mounts for the early SE cars. But there are plenty of other places that will fabricate something for you - how do you think folks are undertaking their engine conversions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chazpowerslide Posted March 14, 2003 Share Posted March 14, 2003 Sorry B George, that was the first (and maybe the last) time I have tried to do a link to another site. IRRC the address is www.rawengineering.co.uk Once you get there click on the Toyota tab. I have no idea why the link did not work Chaz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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