I wonder if this would harm kits and/or classics?

[Lyonspride]

http://www.theimi.org.uk/news/imi-calls-government-licence-automotive-sector

 

When they asked for this in the electrical installations sector, they got "Part P", which makes it an offence to carrying out DIY work on most of your homes electrics, even if you (like me) are qualified and experienced.

 

I can easily see it getting to the point of requiring certification just to change a pair of windscreen wipers.

[XTR2Turbo]

Surely it is the responsibility anyway of all those employers to ensure that their employees are suitably skilled or trained for the jobs they are doing

[Rory's Dad]

IMI protecting themselves and trying to increase the size of their business IMO

[pistonbroke]

Who here would want to sit in a driverless car ? don't see it catching on myself 

[Lyonspride]

Rather a driverless car than anything being driven by my step father.......

[SootySport]

You have to have a licence to work  in the Gas, Telecomms, Aviation and Electric industries, so why not in the Automotive industry.

If you work in Germany the licence to work list is much larger, even to be a Travel Agent.

 

I do wonder what us men in sheds and garages are going to do in their spare time though.

[Rory's Dad]

I do wonder what us men in sheds and garages are going to do in their spare time though.

 

Pay for it 

[SootySport]

Or flower arranging Martin

[jeff oakley]

There are many things behind this. The EU is being lobbied hard by the manufacturers to get control of the repairs of cars back to them. They have tried restricting the supply of information to the aftermarket to stop parts being produced and information to allow the repair of cars and trucks.

They have been trying to exploit loopholes in the EU anti competitive laws, which allows them to restrict information which is security sensitive, so lots of seemingly minor things are linked into the canbus security settings.So far all of these have been defeated so they are now trying a different tack.

On the face of it why would you want anyone who is not qualified working on your car? Well the reality is the dealer networks will have control of information and this will restrict those wanting to become "qualified". As I said they are lobbying hard to ensure via the IMI that they get the upper hand on this forcing motorists to have no option but to use the dealer networks. This will cost us all in the long run if they get their way.

There are also conflicting groups at work who want control of the training and certification, The IMI, British Standards, TUV all have a vested interest as training is a multi billion pound industry.

As an industry you can find lots of good garages with well trained staff who work to a higher standard than a dealer, you also can find some right dives with bad practice.

We do need some form of registration but one which allows choice, for the driver, one that does not preclude by expense independents from competing and allowances made for hobbies to flourish in the motor trade. Classic cars alone are estimated to be worth over £30 million a year, allowing bad restrictions to happen will put an end to a lot of this.

[Lyonspride]

You have to have a licence to work  in the Gas, Telecomms, Aviation and Electric industries, so why not in the Automotive industry.

If you work in Germany the licence to work list is much larger, even to be a Travel Agent.

 

I do wonder what us men in sheds and garages are going to do in their spare time though.

 

There's always Eastenders, Coronation Street, Xfactor, BGT, "im a celebrity", big brother, strictly come dancing and countless other mindless distractions sent to keep the population compliant (or stupid)............

[Lyonspride]

Classic cars alone are estimated to be worth over £30 million a year, allowing bad restrictions to happen will put an end to a lot of this.

 

Indeed, but classic cars are seen as a thorn in the side of the future UK economy.

Govt wants rid because they go against the fast moving, consumerism based culture they are trying to promote. Older cars, without emissions control and running lower MPGs will be painted out to be the smokers of the next decade, socially irresponsible, socially unacceptable and punished with legislation and regulation.

[jeff oakley]

Indeed, but classic cars are seen as a thorn in the side of the future UK economy.

Govt wants rid because they go against the fast moving, consumerism based culture they are trying to promote. Older cars, without emissions control and running lower MPGs will be painted out to be the smokers of the next decade, socially irresponsible, socially unacceptable and punished with legislation and regulation.

Not true. The UK has fought hard to keep the Classic and Kit Car industry going. It brings in millions and as the cars are used infrequently, are recycled over and over so are seen as not being a big problem in the scheme of things. They also changed the law to allow classics over a certain age to be MOT free. Compare with France where classic car use is restricted and self built cars are outlawed.

From next year every new car is going to be illegal to sell without Ecall fitted. this is a system that calls the police if you have an accident automatically. Good idea? Yes for the poor sod who has an accident, but the system is a black box that constantly can send information to who ever is allowed it. So if you have an accident they can download every throttle input, every steering input, every braking move and yes speed. In Scotland last month a guy knocked down a pedestrian. The police blamed the pedestrian, however, when they took the insurance black box he had been forced to have by his insurance, they found he had been speeding in every limit and at the time of the accident was speeding before the impact, although at the limit the accident would still have happened. In this case the driver had a history of bans etc, but without that data it would have been just an unfortunate accident.

How many of us speed every day? How many of us accelerate hard away from lights etc, imagine how easy to empty our pockets that would be?

Motorists are a cash cow for too many people, the manufacturers want us to keep buying new cars, want to control service costs, insurance wants to charge us on habits they define and government wants to charge us to own, to use and to fine when we transgress. Telematics allow all of those with ease.

[Lyonspride]

^^

 

Some people want classics and kits, some people do not. Once the "do not"s are in the majority, things will take a very different turn.

We like to think we don't have the sort of corruption that is present in other countries around the world, but the truth is we do, it's just more subtle and better hidden by media driven distractions (those bonkers news stories that get everyone wound up enough to miss whats going on elsewhere).

 

Which leads me on to eCall, the system is apparently in hibernation until an accident occurs, truth? who knows?

What I do know, is that every time something like this is forced in by legislation, there is usually one company in control of the product or device, a company which has shareholders, shareholders who are probably already filthy rich and shareholders who have "friends in high places". eCall device data is more likely to be sold on and used by private companies for advertising/etc, than it is to be used for legal purposes by UK authorities.

 

The system will not be "perfect" enough for it's data to ever stand up in a court of law, although in much the same way as the DVLA operate, someone could throw threats at you in the hope you'll pay up without knowing your rights.

It's no longer possible to get out of a speeding fine by presenting GPS data, but it'd be ok the other way around?

 

If all else fails, I have a circuit diagram for a Russian designed portable GPS jammer. Diagrams available on the internet, unless that's been censored too.

There were talks of these tracking devices being fitted to all cars (old or new) about 10 years ago, with the intention of the data being uploaded at MOT time and fines issued automatically.

[dombanks]

given jeffs view, cant wait for driver less cars. i can just sit there and let someone else/thing drive me to work for 40 mins while i snooze or read and not have to deal with all the *swearing moderated* on the bridge and in speke.

[Dommo]

In Scotland last month a guy knocked down a pedestrian. The police blamed the pedestrian, however, when they took the insurance black box he had been forced to have by his insurance, they found he had been speeding in every limit and at the time of the accident was speeding before the impact, although at the limit the accident would still have happened. In this case the driver had a history of bans etc, but without that data it would have been just an unfortunate accident.

 

I found that case particularly interesting. Essentially, the guy had the evidence of his insurance black box tracker used against him. However, my friend recently went to court for speeding in a 20.He produced evidence from his black box that showed he was only doing 16mph and the police officer must have collared the wrong guy. The evidence was dismissed though as it was not a government approved device. Which kind of makes sense. So it seemed a bit two-faced that you can have it used against you, but you can't prove your innocence with it.

 

Maybe it's a Scottish law vs English law kind of thing.