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North / South venue debate has been going on since first year of the Speed Series ......... sadly there is very little anyone can do about it. Attendance figures were always lower for southern based events, (even in the heady days of 100+ drivers) sometimes it is not possible to provide a definitive answer, that's life ............ is low attendance good reason to remove them from the calendar ?............. for some yes, for others no ............. it takes more than looking at spread sheets to make an informed decision (IMHO) ................ it needs consultation with as many as possible, as to why drivers attend and why they don't, sometimes when its their nearest circuit. If any event is removed does this necessarily mean forever or just for a year or two ........ ? For any organiser to make a decision they should also have knowledge and have driven at each event they have to make a decision on ................. Good Luck everyone, be safe - Remember that the success of the WSCC Speed Series as a whole is more important than any one individual

Barny, I agree we need to understand the objective and then work towards this and yes I would have done Gurston had I been competing this year. There is however something that has bugged me for a while so this seams the time to air it. we appear to be selecting venues on a time on the track (either number of runs or event length) must mean better value for money? i don’t entirely agree, for me one of the core skills of sprint and hill climbs is the ability to extract maximum performance from 2/3 timed runs I.e the ability to be “on it”from the outset dealing with whatever the conditions throw at you. IMHO when you get beyond 3 timed runs, times don’t get much faster and it simply becomes a battle of who is the bravest or to put it another way who has the balls to take the most risks, not nesesarily the most skill, yep controversial I know! Some of my most satisfying events have had only 2 timed runs, because I felt I had extracted the maximum when the pressure was on to perform with no options to have another run if I cocked up,,, in fact my best day ever consisted of a single short timed run. I’m in no way comparing myself but there is a reason drivers like Hamilton and Senna are considered the best of the best, there ability to perform that one perfect qualifying lap when the pressure is on,,, i guess it boils down to how you view value for money, quality v quantity, I know which I prefer ta Barry

Nearly there up and running just needs mapping

Sorry I'm late to the party there are a few points that are made here let me address some:- and give you an insight into the conversations/discusions we have. We are too northern! The northern/southern bias; we send a survey out to all drivers last year and we have been accused of being too northern and also too southern in the same breath as we have no Scottish events. We have too many events/ too few events! The calendar was extended to approx. 37 events last season to see if it improved the numbers this didn''t happen. Question By increasing the events we do we thin the field and reduce "the craic" that we are famous for. Also when we had 2 sets of times for novices and experts and then with 32 events and then 8 classes 2x8x32 is 512 (times) which was part of the reason for merging the target times for novice and expert; we then decided that more focus on the awards night be made for the novices. Question: So taking it to the extremes do we reduce to 20 events and then have a big turn out? what is the perfect number? 15 hills & 15 sprint? We are too expert focused and don't want a novice to win! This is why in this years regs we tried to make more focus on novice awards The SSOT is not representive of my views Then if you feel that then please let me know, please remember I can't please everyone all the time. but we actually do want to make the speed series last another 21 years. Other Points Nick is right as a sport we are struggling as you cant take a stock Westfield and enter the speed series because of the rules imposed by the MSA. We have looked at not being part of the MSA or running a separate series (personally I'm not insured if I race under anything that is not msa approved. as I had to declare it on the insurance form) this has been agenda point for the last 2 seasons and both occasions it was decided not to change. So what do I need? A healthy debate and conversation, we have not edited, censored or hidden any posts so far, please do not get personal I think by letting this thread ride you will see the problems the members have trying to do the best for you, Please remember we are all volunteers, unlike some events/series where the person doing it is a full time/part time job. what are our Objectives please see Many Thanks John "Panda" Williams johnpdwilliams@hotmail.com

That makes sense John. Which leads me to a thought... What would be great is for the SSOT to define what the purpose, vision or mission for the Speed Series is. We often talk about getting more people involved, but to what end? What kind of people? What level are we looking to appeal to? We have 47 entrants this year, of which based on last year's numbers, 18 will do 10 or more events, 14 will do 5 to 10 events and the rest will do between none and 4 events. So really only 32 participants. Given the numbers have been declining, alongside what Nick helpfully shares is a wider issue, it would be really helpful to know what the SS is trying to achieve so we can all input to helping accomplish that goal. I don't think telling people to volunteer for the SSOT is helpful - there is access to way more input and ideas via this forum or through modern digital media - maybe a radical shake up is the way to go? Ref diary availability - it truly amazed me that people were able to commit to so many events, every year. Doing the 11 or 12 events I did in 2016 completely took over my life, meaning time away from my wife, my family and my friends. In the short term, I don't see being able to do that again, hence going for the 5 event championships. It's important to acknowledge that not everyone is in the same position as the core competitors who regularly do 10 or more events. So I circle back to my opening point - what exactly is the SS aiming to achieve? If it's more competitors, maybe a shake up to what's always gone before is needed, even if it negatively impacts the 'core' in favour of achieving the SS's goal.

Over the last few evenings I've had a bit of time to escape into the garage to do a few jobs. I didn't have a set of radius rod connecting forks for the second car amongst the spares but I did have a set that had been part machined in the past. I'm not sure if these were from the original stock or a later remanufacture but using them would save me a lot of time and expense of getting some made from scratch. This is one of the clevis's on the first car and shows what they should look like And this shows what I have to work with. First job was to drill down the centre for the threaded stud, to make sure everything was centralised I did this in the lathe. Next task was to tap the hole I'd just drilled out to 3/8" UNF And finally it was back into the lathe to part them off at the correct length. There's another two still to make and then the studs need threading to the correct length.

Results for Gurston Down have now been published and I suspect this post will attact an audience of 2 So I hope Howard & Barney get around to reading it. Gurston Down Results (R5) Tiggs

John sadly the numbers are no longer there - The SS started with around 20 in its first year and within just a few short years was 100+ - full of newcomers and from other championships incl us both that was then - its different times now. As it stands you are always going to upset the minority because with only 47 registered drivers (how many will actually compete for a full championship number of events) everyone is in the minority time to change the business model, get new blood in tap into the WSCC enthusiasm and make it attractive in a new way, not re-hash the old model. Talk to every driver, talk to every event organiser, steal ideas

far as i'm concerned . dropping the south events is not going to get me up north more. i tried getting in goodwood this weekend but it was sold out . so even with noise issues its still a popular event there's plenty of clubs that still use these venues so that's where it looks like i will be going next year .

From some of the comments above there seems to be an inference that the SSOT are Northern biased in there choice of venue, and that Mr Everall wants to cull events. I'm not an active SS competitor and don't know all the members of the SSOT, but if there is genuine concern about a "Northern" bias then can I suggest that "Southern" members put themselves forward to join the SSOT, in the interest of balance. As for Mr E being the harbinger of doom, I suspect it more a question of him appearing to be the most vocal SSOT member on here....... Nice to see debate on this subject and some interesting suggestions...

A couple of years ago the SSOT came up with a set of objectives/rules, bearing this in mind then all other decisions should be measured by the objectives. • Make the competition simple. • Increase level of new competitors. • Sustain levels of existing competitors. • Keep the cost of ‘starting’ to compete as affordable as possible. • To make the competition sustainable. • Prioritise changes for the good of the organisation/speed series. We published this internally and have been using these as guidelines when we when making judgment calls for the Speed Series. Many Thanks John Williams

Time will tell, but with David Richards taking over at the MSA, there have been some indications of a desire to considering relaxing regulations where appropriate, so we will see.

I’m only thinking out loud here .... but if I remember did you move your rear tub forward to give clearance for the carpet ? If so this would need to be added to marks 40/45 mm measurement putting it in line with your eyebolts, as if measuring from the bulkhead not the tub front edge sorry for playing devils advocate here and throwing another option into the mix

Nice, but it's no crossflow.

My job is done then - I feel a great deal of satisfaction lol Cheers guys ..... luv ya

Yup

Mark , although I agree with your comment I feel the MSA has put up a brick wall and locked out all the casual competitors with all the rule changes over the last few years , especially ROPS, tyres, hans, etc. So no matter what the SSOT do they are limited by the winkers at the MSA

Read and enjoyed!!

With the amount of double header weekend events on the calendar only 5 weekends from March through October would do the job. I do get your point though. We quite often see your exploits on FB entering Javelin events and other events in your father's Mini so I'm a bit confused with what you are trying to get across? If there was a 5 event championship you are hinting that you would enter it? Have you already entered the one that exists? Another thing to think about is the fact that events that are poorly attended do not have competitors in all classes present. Therefore scoring and target times becomes an issue, especially if a new venue or target times need to be calculated to fill in the gaps. When I first started off competing, one of the biggest attractions was the amount of other like minded Westfield and SS competitors in the paddock who were available to help and offer advice if needed along with the camaraderie. With low entries at some events this would be lacking for newcomers I see no reason in upsetting the core at the expense of the minority.

There are those who would and do only compete at venues local to them. Every venue seems to have its local experts and regulars and whilst I agree with you that having more venues would possibly attract more entrants to the SS, in reality they would more than likely only enter the one closest to them that they know and love. Getting them further afield would be the challenge to do more events towards the 10 that count...

I will book at the weekend... if the weather looks ok.. Booking now with Russ the rain magnet attending is too risky

Driving in socks...tut tut....

Yep!! Perhaps thinking outside box.

I have attended both Gurston and Wiscombe events for the past four years and would have been there again this year if they were part of our calendar and my car ready. I've worked hard to improve my times at these events, thoroughly enjoy them and intend to continue to compete at both. Terry, IMO you and the SSOT need to look very carefully at the direction the SS is going in, we are gradually turning into a Northern Sprint Series. Speed Series numbers are down in general, as Howard mentioned 22 SS competitors at Gurston 8 years ago and I doubt 22 SS competitors will complete a championship scoring 10 rounds this year, despite holding 12 rounds at the ever popular Anglesey and Blyton venues, therefore dropping events your paying entrants want to attend even if in small numbers at times is not the solution. In these changing times, to survive the SSOT needs to be innovative, look at new ways to be more inclusive, encourage novices and try as best as possible to provide events in all areas of the country, maybe GF's suggestion was not so way out after all !!!!! So can I come back next year and enjoy these events or do I have to look at other championships ?

Graham.....Your proposal that we had limitless events in our calendar was deemed to be impractical and would not benefit the the competitors. You were in a minority of 1 and hence your proposal was not accepted. We do need to determine the correct number of events to support which is why I started this thread. We need to hear the ideas of the majority as well as the few.

@tc3nitro I drilled 12mm holes each end to start with,then joined them together with a 1mm disc in the angry grinder,then used a dremel type multi tool with drum sander bits in it to remove the majority of the material,then finished off with hand files

Just a thought but is 37 events not spreading things too thinly?

Keep your trousers on and save a fortune

Pretty pleased with the outcome tbf

13x6 Minilite style from Rally Design - with 185/60 NS2R Tyres

Have it