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Guest thefuturesorange

Anyone with KMS duratec?

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Guest thefuturesorange

Hi folks,

Thanks again for the catch tank advice; nice Mocal oil catch tank now fitted to scuttle. :)

Wondered if anyone has a duratec with the Dutch tuning firm KMS fitted throttle bodies and ECU. When I bought my Sport 2000 kit from Westfield in 2008 they had changed from Webcon to KMS. They had a real problem to get it to run right- two trips back to the factory during build. So far the car has done 1000 miles and while the engine has improved some over time not convinced its giving it's best. Tick over is very uneven and although it passed IVA etc. seems to run pretty rich, or this is just a factor of throttle body installs? I'm sure it's not giving anything like the 200 BHP figure Westfield claim.

Has anyone had such a set up rolling roaded? Apart from the throttle bodies and ECU the engine is standard Ford unit as far as I know.

Thanks, Rob

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Luapno

I have got them on my duratec and havent had any major problems. Yet to have it on the rollers though. The only issue I have is a slight hesitation for a couple of minutes when cold. Once it warms up it goes fine. Sorry it's not much help.

I would suggest a trip to somewhere like NMS to get them set up properly

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chappers
NMS rolling roaded my brothers (now mine) duratec with KMS ECU. They found a misfire that they just couldn't map out no matter what they did. Must have been something wrong with the KMS ECU. In the end they just fitted an Omex ECU and loom which is apparently easier to map. Even with the Omex ECU and a non-cat sports exhaust it only makes 183bhp. Don't know where Westfield got the 200 bhp claim from, as I doubt if any factory 2.0 duratecs get anywhere near 200 bhp.

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KC7

Kev is correct.

Troy had real issues trying to map the car and initially I seem to recall that the car only made 169 bhp. In the end I decided to let Troy replace the KMS ECU (because of the misfire) with the OMEX unit which hopefully will be easier to map going forward. 183.1 bhp was a significant improvement but still quite a long way of 200 bhp.

The KMS unit should be OK and I believe it is meant to be "self learning" but mine just didn't seem to be right :).  

Kev - I hope you are enjoying the car buddy :).

Keith

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stephenh

It started with the Webcon Alpha kit I believe. They (Webcon) claimed 204 bhp, but it was a good one to exceed 180 when installed in a Westfield. The KMS kit makes as much power as a Webcon Alpha, so one thing leads to another.....

Having said that, my engine is now making 272 bhp, and it still runs the same KMS throttle bodies as were fitted by Westfield, so they cant be too bad!!

Actually, they may not be the first ones fitted by Westfield, they were sent back to KMS under warranty, because the engine wouldn't tick over cleanly when it was hot, it ticked over too fast, no matter what you tried to do with the throttle stops. Something was wrong with the assembly of the throttle linkages, and as they came as a complete assembled package from KMS they were shipped out complete by Westfield to KMS. I believe they have reverted to supplying the Webcon Alpha now, because of problems with the KMS.

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Charlie_sav

sounds like a change of the ecu or ingnition amp could have sorted it,

The KMS ecu nobody likes because it's different to map, does not have a 3d plotted map that you can pull about to make up a quick rough map,

But it is quick to map, set a speed site and run up and down load sites pick the next speed site and repeat, the wideband lambda just made it even faster than the manual input of each load site, can't remember that well but something like a second at each load site and the lambda/ecu would have it sorted, a few quick keys saved this to the base map. you could fly through a map with easy,   but to me the system had some issues the new lambda sensor with display looks geat but kills lambda sensors when the gauge dies, not enough pins left on the connector for new things you have to drop aircon if you are running a silly turbo'd car, the box could not be closed if you are using the serial cable for the lambda display,  but for the turbo boys the extra functions you get for the cash are great and the hardware, throttle bodies etc are very good quality.  but my next ecu will be a DTA 600 i think mapped at track and road.

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Guest thefuturesorange

Thanks for responses. I recall in the end Westfield returned car with completely new injection unit and I presume another ecu. Troy descibes KMS 'clunky' to sort but seemed reasonably hopeful in his email that some inprovement could be made. I guess a trip to NMS is the way to go.

It just annoys me that Westfield claim bogus power outputs and having spent alot of money buying the kit it dosn't deliver in the way claimed. Having said that my single throttle-bodied zetec car never ran that well either (a drive down to the factory being required after IVA for ecu remapping) so I guess Westfield just don't do the necessary development to have things properly sorted before sales.

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Charlie_sav

The power output claims would be down to westfield the ecu system is more than adequate.

some vids from kms on youtube, the 600bhp VW camper has got to be the best sleeper.

KMS youtube

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hoobahole
My std duratec was RRd at 194bhp on the Webcon rolling road with their Alpha kit as supplied by WF. That was with the WF cat exhaust fitted.

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davewilding
I built my sport 2000 nearly two years ago. It is fitted with the KMS ECU and TB's Initially, the tick over was rough and low rpm gentle acceleration was hesitant. The tb's were patiently re-balanced and that solved the tick over, Some work with the ECU mapping and particularly the critical area of the Throttle position sensor seems to cure the flat spot and it runs great now. I have not had it RR'd since I am not too bothered about the last few HP but I have modified the radiator fan control, so that it is driven from the ECU and hence engine core temp rather than the thermostat mounted halfway down the rad which is a stupid idea. Also added a low fuel warning which again is a simple mod and can be driven from the ECU aux outs. Details of my mods on request. cheers

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Steven (WE51STE) - Joint Warwickshire AO

I've got a 2.0l Duratec but with OMEX 600 ECU.

My car was used to give them a standard map for the engine and they tuned and played all day.

The car was just shy of 180 BHP and they commented that was the ball park they expected ( Brand new engine and it was a very hot day with temps over 35 degrees in the garage. )

I mentioned I was disappointed that it wasn't 200+ as advertised in the marketing literature.

They didn't believe a std engine on TB could achieve the quoted 204 unless the RR had been tweaked.

They then showed me how easy it is for people to achieve what ever figure they require.

You can have your engine tuned properly or you can have a figure to talk about at the bar.

I know which one I'd prefer.

All I know is that for the moment the 180 BHP will suffice.

Steve

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nikpro
I've got a 2.0l Duratec but with OMEX 600 ECU.

My car was used to give them a standard map for the engine and they tuned and played all day.

The car was just shy of 180 BHP and they commented that was the ball park they expected ( Brand new engine and it was a very hot day with temps over 35 degrees in the garage. )

I mentioned I was disappointed that it wasn't 200+ as advertised in the marketing literature.

They didn't believe a std engine on TB could achieve the quoted 204 unless the RR had been tweaked.

They then showed me how easy it is for people to achieve what ever figure they require.

You can have your engine tuned properly or you can have a figure to talk about at the bar.

I know which one I'd prefer.

All I know is that for the moment the 180 BHP will suffice.

Steve

Well said that man!  :t-up:

...........and anybody that doesn't have their newly built car Mapped is a fool IMO - why spend so much money and not 'finish' the car?

The Map you may be running could be destroying the engine - it's not about the last few BHP - it's about having the car running right.

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Guest thefuturesorange

Yes would be interested in some details Dave; email rob@whartons.org.uk. The uneven tickover you mentioned sounds just like the problem I have. Did you go to NMS to sort the problems initially?

Cheers, Rob

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