How toxic is your car exhaust? We knew this, a good, but long read

[Trevor Little (Trevturtle) - Treasurer]

Linky

[stephenh]

Very interesting, but I wonder how many of us petrol heads actually base there car buying decisions on how toxic or otherwise a car is? We might like to think we do, but in truth isn't other factors which are far more important to us in our decisions? 

My daily driver is a 2015 Skoda Octavia estate, with a diesel engine. I bought it because it was one of the roomiest diesel estates in my budget and I liked the spec. Why a diesel? Well I'm getting better than 45 mpg. long term average, even though a lot of my driving is very short runs into town and back (I live just 2 miles from my local town) on a cold engine.

If I was a bit more thoughtful and considerate about my car and driving choices, I probably wouldn't be driving a Westfield, at least not one which has a big Weber and coil and distributor ignition!

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

Fascinating but not too surprising in the main. One of the big downfalls of the EU and other bureaucratic institutions is their obsession with control in the face of common sense. My ten year old X-Type (more or less a Ford 2.2 TDCi engine with a few small Jaguar mods) is a Euro 4 so maybe I don't need too feel guilty. As if I did! The deterioration in NOx levels in newer diesel cars is a surprise, I admit.

It's taken decades for the 'scientists' to declare that the levels of exhaust fumes inside a car are far worse than outside - even on a bicycle -  when it was bleedin' obvious to anyone who knows anything about where the car's ventilation system gathers its intake air - i.e. down low at the front. You're sitting inside a hermetically sealed chamber filled with constantly refreshed air dosed heavily with the exhaust fumes of the car/van/lorry/bus in front! I smile a wry smile of amusement when I see Lycra-clad cyclists wearing face masks. Not only is the air much cleaner where they are, but fabric doesn't filter gases; it takes a more sophisticated filter to do that. But they're making a point - as if I care!

[Rory's Dad]

The EU is a laughing stock over this. They are just mugs and not helping the car buying public at all. Idiots (IMO of course).

[DamperMan]

In all anti diesel reports there is a special word they add.   "localised"    Yes the NOx causes this but still the Co2 global warming is better for the diesels.     I've come to the conclusion governments do little unless they are lobbied.    And they do most if they are lobbied by big tax revenue creating industries.      The current rush to sell your evil diesel and replace with a lovely green new model just is fantastic for car manufactures with the right products now.    I don't think we'll ever know the true environmental impact is of making a car vs using it, but they suggest the first 10 years of use equals the CO2 the CO2 just from manufacturing the car.   Buying new or throwing away perfectly good older cars in the name of Green does not stack up as we are lead to believe.       

Green peace stopped car transporter ship full of diesel cars.  They missed the point.   "the ship"   

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2008/feb/13/climatechange.pollution   

We can not go on the way we are polluting the world as we are,  but equally i don't feel i know the truth as media, governments, etc have there own agenda.      The kids at school learned it was best to Reuse and if not then recycle.    in that note we should all continue to reused old bits for cars to make new ones!....   and keep our mileages down....  

 

 

[DonPeffers]

Is this why other motorists become enraged when overtaken as then they have more fumes ahead of them?

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

Yeah, but.... Then they are fuming themselves! 

[Thrustyjust]

Must admit , I thought it was quite interesting. Our 2000 Audi 2.5 V6 TDI used to give better fuel economy than any of our later smaller capacitied cars we have owned afterwards. We used to regulary see over 45 mpg on that and quite illegal speeds, but we cant even get near it , sticking to 60 mph on nearly new cars. I do question the dpf senario and the fact it needs neat fuel injected in, to create a furnace to burn the soot out. Common sense tells me, that burning any kind of fuel to create this process will a/ lower mpg b/ cause more emmisions. I cant believe that the Nissan is so horrendously NoX unfriendly and something should be done with these types of vehicles. 

[pistonbroke]

Just one Jumbo flight to USA burns fossil fuel measured in tons , how about the pollution many millions of flights PA cause to the mother earth ? 

 

[Steve (sdh2903)]

17 minutes ago, pistonbroke said:

Just one Jumbo flight to USA burns fossil fuel measured in tons , how about the pollution many millions of flights PA cause to the mother earth ? 

 

Air transport is around 10% vs 70% for road transport for co2 production iirc

[jeff oakley]

It all depends on what you measure, what you measure against and what you are trying to prove. 

We are bombarded with what are the biggest polluters and it is true that the 15 biggest ships in the world pollute more than all the cars we have at present, if you measure one type of emission. Cars are easier to target than planes and shipping so they are the obvious targets but they are not the worst at all.

If you measure energy used in producing and shipping clothing it is the largest polluter. 

Regulations are there to be passed by the manufacturers, they do that but the real world is different hence they never reach those figures claimed. Green activists convinced politicians that Co2 was the evil to beat and diesel was they way disregarding advice over NOx.

Fast forward to now and only electric will do, ignoring the devastation mining lithium for batteries creates and cities around the world calmer to be greenest and to tax diesels off the road.

Tomorrow they will discover electric is a problem but all the time some will get rich on the back of it and we will have to pay one way or another.

[Thrustyjust]

8 hours ago, jeff oakley said:

It all depends on what you measure, what you measure against and what you are trying to prove. 

We are bombarded with what are the biggest polluters and it is true that the 15 biggest ships in the world pollute more than all the cars we have at present, if you measure one type of emission. Cars are easier to target than planes and shipping so they are the obvious targets but they are not the worst at all.

If you measure energy used in producing and shipping clothing it is the largest polluter. 

Regulations are there to be passed by the manufacturers, they do that but the real world is different hence they never reach those figures claimed. Green activists convinced politicians that Co2 was the evil to beat and diesel was they way disregarding advice over NOx.

Fast forward to now and only electric will do, ignoring the devastation mining lithium for batteries creates and cities around the world calmer to be greenest and to tax diesels off the road.

Tomorrow they will discover electric is a problem but all the time some will get rich on the back of it and we will have to pay one way or another.

The world of cars has always been the same Jeff. Its a quick plaster cure and not forward thinking to the next stage of what harm it will cause.

[Chris Hooper]

As a matter of interest I had a Skoda fabia greenline 2. I do a lot of miles and my car was recalled by VW Skoda for  an emissions test after 8 months as it was the highest mileage one they could find. Apparently they were required to emissions test the car after use in the real world. I never new the outcome but they did service it and replaced the brake pads for free so it was good with me.