Poor running - 2ltr Pinto

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

25 thou is too wide - the ignition will now be heavily advanced. They would usually be about 15 thou but anyway, it's no good altering the gap (if there is one!) without setting static advance. Mine has no vacuum (it doesn't work on individual chokes anyway, it needs a common manifold), a significant static advance, and an Aldon Ignitor. It is a difficult to start - seems as if the battery is down - because the high degree of static advance causes the engine to fight the starter once it fires. I have a technique: pump the pedal a dozen times, crank it with no throttle until it speeds up with weak firing (insufficient to run, but enough to aid the cranking), then a little throttle to 'catch' it. Starts even after months like that. Two provisos: good battery, and carbs full (listen to the fuel pump and leave it to fill the carbs and then slow down to a stop).

[Captain Colonial]

I'm pretty sure gap is dependant upon dizzy manufacturer - Motorcraft / Ford is 0.025, Lucas is 0.016.

Anyway, going breakerless ignition is definitely a no-brainer unless you're into being chronically bent over your engine with a feeler gauge.

Although my CVH had a basic non-points dizzy, I too suffered from the hard starting procedure that was a battery killer because of the high advance just like MotCO.  My cold start procedure was pump primed, 3.5 full pedal pumps, let the pump refill the bowls, then quarter throttle and turn starter.  Usually worked but the starter always fought the engine because of the advance and sometimes the battery lost.  Thank goodness that isn't normal procedure any more since converting to throttle bodies and an ECU - I'd forgotten what it was like to have an engine that cranks freely.

[^Qwerty^]

Dumb question, but from those photo's, do you know what dizzy it is? Looks like I can order the electronic conversion kit to go inside my current one rather than buy a whole new unit.

Thanks

--

Mike

[Man On The Clapham Omnibus]

You may well be right about Ford points gaps, Scott, I haven't owned a non-injected Ford except my Pinto engined Westfield. In any case, the static timing is critical. One possible technique for starting is to contrive to spun the engine with the ignition off, then to switch it one while it is at full crank speed. Unfortunately the Aldon Ignitor doesn't do anyhting different from points except go on forever untouched. What I do know for sure is that if a gap becomes wider, the timing is advanced, and vice versa so a worn down cam follower heel will steadily retard the ignition and probably lead to poor running as described. My old Hillman Hunter had Lucas points and one fell off while driving leaving the carrier to meet the opposing point and the gap went to 45 thou from 15  thou and the timing to about 60º BTDC instantly. The exhaust system blew up with the ensuing backfire! Luckily this all happened outside a Rootes Group garage which sold ignition parts and I was on my way, albeit noisily, within half an hour. Those were the days when I carried a full tool kit everywhere.

[Captain Colonial]

7 hours ago, ^Qwerty^ said:

Dumb question, but from those photo's, do you know what dizzy it is? Looks like I can order the electronic conversion kit to go inside my current one rather than buy a whole new unit.

Thanks

--

Mike

Ford or Lucas are usually labelled quite prominently somewhere on the outer casing of the dizzy itself.  May need to clean it up a bit to find it and use a mirror to see it if it's obscured.

Looking at the photo of the old points again, wow are those toasted!  Have you got an old set you can put back in and try before splashing out any funds, just to confirm the diagnosis?  Can't tell but the contacts inside the dizzy cap might need cleaning with an emery board as well, check the rotor arm as well.

As MotCO rightly says, static timing is critical.  Make sure you set the points gap with the block on one of the four high spots on the dizzy cam or it will definitely not work.  I'd start with his suggestion of 0.016 first.

[merp0]

Looks like a Ford Motorcraft Dizzy.

[^Qwerty^]

1 hour ago, merp0 said:

Looks like a Ford Motorcraft Dizzy.

New set of points in and it fired straight up. I've not run it down the road yet but did seem to be running better. Many thanks for the pointers so far. After this I'll look into a conversion.

 

[SootySport]

If you still have problems after all the above has been checked, then you need to check the cambelt has been fitted correctly, one tooth out and you'll have problems like you described.

[Lyonspride]

I had the issue described in the first post MANY years ago, I spent a great deal of money trying to get it fixed but nobody could fix it, turned out to simply be a vacuum leak, perished misab plates between carb and inlet manifold. Give it revs it sucks air in through the gap, this weakens the mixture and the engine stutters.